Wikipedia:In the news/Candidates

This page provides a forum for editors to suggest items for inclusion on In the news (ITN), a protected template on the Main Page, as well as the forum for discussion of candidates. This is not the page to report errors in the ITN section on the Main Page—please go to the appropriate section at WP:ERRORS. Archives of past nominations can be found here.

This candidates page is integrated with the daily pages of Portal:Current events. Under each daily section header below is the transcluded Portal:Current events items for that day (with a light green header). Each day's portal page is followed by a subsection for suggestions and discussion.

A blurb is a one sentence summary of the news story. An alternate suggestion for the blurb is called an altblurb, and any more suggestions get labelled alt1, alt2, etc. A blurb needs at least one target article, highlighted in bold; reviewers check the quality of that article and whether it is updated, and whether reliable sources demonstrate the significance of the event. Other articles can also be linked. The Ongoing line is for regularly updated articles which cover events that remain in the news over a longer period of time. RD stands for the "recent deaths" line, and can include any living thing whose death was recently announced. In some cases, recent deaths may need additional explanation as provided by a blurb; this is decided by consensus.

New York City Wildfires in Canada cause evacuations and hazardous air conditions across parts of North America (New York City pictured). In Ukraine, the Kakhovka Dam is breached, causing flooding and prompting mass evacuations. Flooding across Haiti leaves at least 51 people dead and 11 others missing. At least 275 people are killed and over 1,175 others injured in a collision involving three trains in Balasore, India. In cricket, the Indian Premier League concludes with the Chennai Super Kings defeating the Gujarat Titans in the final. Recep Tayyip Erdoğan is re-elected President of Turkey in a runoff. Ongoing: Russian invasion of Ukraine Sudan conflict Recent deaths: Astrud Gilberto Yukiko Takayama Kurt Widmer Robert Hanssen Cynthia Weil Natasha Al-Maani view — page history — related changes — edit

How to nominate an item In order to suggest a candidate: Update an article to be linked to from the blurb to include the recent developments, or find an article that has already been updated. Find the correct section below for the date of the event (not the date nominated). Do not add sections for new dates. These are automatically generated (at midnight UTC) by a bot; creating them manually breaks this process. Nominate the blurb for ITN inclusion under the "Suggestions" subheading for the date, emboldening the link in the blurb to the updated article. Use a level 4 header (====) when doing so. Preferably use the template {{ITN candidate}} to nominate the article related to the event in the news. Make sure that you include a reference from a verifiable, reliable secondary source. Press releases are not acceptable. The suggested blurb should be written in simple present tense. Adding an explanation why the event should be posted greatly increases the odds of posting. Please consider alerting editors to the nomination by adding the template {{ITN note}} to the corresponding article's talk page. There are criteria which guide the decision on whether or not to put a particular item on In the news, based largely on the extensiveness of the updated content and the perceived significance of the recent developments. These are listed at WP:ITN. Submissions that do not follow the guidelines at Wikipedia:In the news will not be placed onto the live template. Headers Items that have been posted or pulled from the main page are generally marked with (Posted) or (Pulled) in the item's subject so it is clear they are no longer active. Items can also be marked as (Ready) when the article is both updated and there seems to be a consensus to post. The posting admin, however, should always judge the update and the consensus to post themselves. If you find an entry that you don't feel is ready to post is marked (Ready), you should remove the mark in the header. Voicing an opinion on an item Format your comment to contain "support" or "oppose", and include a rationale for your choice. In particular, address the notability of the event, the quality of the article, and whether it has been updated. Please do... Pick an older item to review near the bottom of this page, before the eligibility runs out and the item scrolls off the page and gets abandoned in the archive, unused and forgotten. Review an item even if it has already been reviewed by another user. Maybe the previous reviewer has missed a problem, or an identified problem has now been fixed. Piling on the list of "support!" votes may also help administrators identify items that are ready for promotion to the ITN template on MainPage. Point out problematic areas in the nominated article and, if appropriate, suggest how to fix them. If you know exactly what to do, by all means, go ahead and fix it as you see fit. Please do not... Add simple "support!" or "oppose!" votes without including your reasons. Similarly, curt replies such as "who?", "meh", or "duh!" are usually not helpful. Instead, explain the reasons why you think the item meets or does not meet the ITN inclusion criteria so a consensus can be reached. Oppose an item solely because the event is only relating to a single country, or failing to relate to one. This applies to a high percentage of the content we post and is generally unproductive. Accuse other editors of supporting, opposing or nominating due to a personal bias (such as ethnocentrism). Conflicts of interest are not handled at ITN. Comment on a story without first reading the relevant article(s). Oppose a recurring item here because you disagree with the recurring items criteria. The criteria can be discussed at the relevant talk page. Use the discussion section of an item as a forum for your own political or personal beliefs. Such comments are irrelevant to the outcome of a nomination and are potentially disruptive. Suggesting updates A posted ITNC item that needs correcting can be addressed in two ways: For simple updates, such as updated death tolls in a disaster, linking issues, spelling or grammar corrections, or otherwise anything that does not change the intent of the blurb should be discussed at WP:ERRORS in the ITN section. For more complex updates that involve a major change in the blurb's intent, that should be discussed as part of the current ITNC nomination.

June 8

Portal:Current events/2023 June 8

June 8, 2023 (2023-06-08) (Thursday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine Attacks on civilians in the Russian invasion of Ukraine Russian forces shell Kherson, injuring nine civilians near an evacuation point in a part of the city flooded after the destruction of the Kakhovka dam. (The New York Times) Afghan conflict Islamic State–Taliban conflict A car bomb outside a mosque in Faizabad, Afghanistan, kills at least eleven people and injures 30 others during a prayer service for the deputy governor of Badakhshan province, who was killed two days ago. The Islamic State claimed responsibility. (BBC News) Disasters and accidents Heavy rains in Savaiʻi, Samoa, cause widespread flooding and infrastructure damage. (RNZ) The Philippine Institute of Volcanology issues a 'level 3 alert' for Mayon Volcano in Albay due to the presence of volcanic earthquakes, indicating an increased risk of lava flows and possible eruptions. Albay Governor Edcel Lagman orders the evacuation of residents within a 6-kilometre radius of the volcano. (Reuters) Law and crime 2023 Annecy stabbing Six people, including four children, are injured in a mass stabbing at Lake Annecy in Haute-Savoie, France. The attacker, a Syrian national, is arrested. (BBC News)

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2023 Manipur violence

Article: 2023 Manipur violence (talk · history · tag)
Ongoing item nomination (Post)
News source(s): Nasdaq The Hindu India Today Reuters
Credits:

• Nominated by Shaheen of Iqbal (talk · give credit)

Article updated

Nominator's comments: The violence and a military operation to quell it is still ongoing when the initial riots started over a month ago. Shaheen of Iqbal (talk) 17:58, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Annecy stabbing

Pictured in 2007

Article: 2023 Annecy stabbing (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ In France, two adults and four children are stabbed in the Le Pâquier in Annecy, Haute-Savoie. (Post)
News source(s): Sky News - NYT - Al Jazeera - France24 - The Guardian
Credits:

• Created and nominated by Frzzl (talk · give credit)
• Updated by 2a02:a03f:8628:f401:d950:eb32:4800:2e9d (talk · give credit), 46.222.181.154 (talk · give credit) and Muboshgu (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: This was nominated by Frzzl (talk · contribs) (see the section below); I've formatted the nom. By the way, can you include redlinks on the main page? - Knightoftheswords281 (Talk · Contribs) 18:32, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Not nominated by me - hence I marked my comment as a comment. I was throwing together an article on it independently, and I checked to see if it was already here, so added a message to the actual nominator Frzzl talk · contribs 18:36, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Okay I'm confused. Do you want the attack to be featured on ITN or not? - Knightoftheswords281 (Talk · Contribs) 18:38, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Wait - no fatalities yet at least, wait until anyone dies. They also seems to making a big deal about this in France, which might barely make the article pass WP:NEVENTS even if no one dies, but alas, that's getting ahead of ourselves. - Knightoftheswords281 (Talk · Contribs) 18:39, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Comments made before inclusion of nombox

Comment I've started an article about it: 2023 Annecy stabbing. Unfortunately, sad as it may be, I think its not major enough to be featured alongside all the other tragedies of this week. Frzzl talk · contribs 16:53, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

That appears to be a domestic incident (homeless refuge) and not what we post st ITN. It also might fail NEVENT as such a small scale incident. Masem (t) 17:11, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

I agree, hence my comment. However, it has attracted widespread international media coverage, so I think it passes notability. If not, we can discuss deletion and merging into Annecy. Frzzl talk · contribs 18:38, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

RD: Wade Goodwyn

Article: Wade Goodwyn (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.npr.org/2023/06/08/1167837454/wade-goodwyn-npr-correspondent-dies
Credits:

• Nominated by GhostStalker (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Ser Amantio di Nicolao (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: NPR National correspondent. Update needs to be sourced. Second time nominating something for ITN/RD, please let me know if I messed something up. GhostStalker (Got a present for ya! / Mission Log) 16:34, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

RD: Marlene van Staden

Article: Marlene van Staden (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Modimolle–Mookgophong mayor Marlene Van Staden loses cancer battle
Credits:

• Nominated by Lefcentreright (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Dylan Fourie (talk · give credit) and Lefcentreright (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Mayor of a large municipality. She was 42. She appeared in the Did You Know section not so long ago.  Lefcentreright  Discuss  13:37, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Solid article and decently referenced. No issues. -Ad Orientem (talk) 13:52, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

RD/Blurb: Pat Robertson

Article: Pat Robertson (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  American televangelist and political figure Pat Robertson (pictured) dies at age 93. (Post)
News source(s): NBC
Credits:

• Nominated by Thriley (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Thriley (talk) 12:21, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Not Ready for the usual reason. -Ad Orientem (talk) 13:49, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Comment Publications section will need citations/ISBNS.-- Pawnkingthree (talk) 13:54, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Would Pat Robertson qualify for a blurb? I'm thinking he's probably just an RD, but I'd like to hear what others have to say on the matter. He was one of the most influential televangelists and had a pretty major impact on the world, for better or for worse. Kurtis ^(talk) 14:07, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  I'd say he was a borderline candidate for a blurb (if/when the referencing issues are corrected). During his career Robertson was certainly very influential in American culture and politics and his views made him a highly controversial figure. But he has been retired/inactive for many years, his influence and name recognition would be almost entirely American, and his death at 93 is not exactly remarkable. Further, we have declined blurb nominations for figures with much stronger claims to fame and influence. Kirk Douglas and Olivia de Havilland come to mind. You are free to modify the nomination and add a proposed blurb, but I doubt it would succeed. -Ad Orientem (talk) 14:18, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  I don't think it's accurate to say he'd been retired/inactive for many years. He was still hosting the 700 club at least as recently as 2019. ~ ONUnicorn^{(Talk|Contribs)}problem solving 18:25, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose blurb besides article quality, only the lefe makes some claim of long term impact (that i could spot), and such an impact must be more apparent and discussed in depth. I also feel the bottom half of the controversies section is most a laundry list of every controversial comment, rather than a big picture look, making that sevtion an POV issue. (This is why we avoid controversy sections) perhaps a section of his views would be better. --Masem (t) 14:46, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  I agree, a RD addition would make sense at most. BeefsteakMaters (talk) 16:43, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Adding blurb per discussion. I myself am neutral, but leaning towards support - Robertson was undoubtedly a major political figure in contemporary American history, being instrumental in the popularization of the evangelical right and being critical figure in that movement's conquest of the party, however, I'm not entirely sure that would warrant blurbing considering that he was aided by a lot of folk in his ilk (i.e, he wasn't the only one). - Knightoftheswords281 (Talk · Contribs) 18:20, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose blurb Man dies at 93, was irrelevant to most of the world and indeed, frankly, to a significant part of the USA. As AD Orientem says, we have declined blurbs for far more influential characters than Robertson. Black Kite (talk) 18:24, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

June 7

Portal:Current events/2023 June 7

June 7, 2023 (2023-06-07) (Wednesday) Arts and culture The Egyptian antiquities ministry prohibits a group of archaeologists from the National Museum of Antiquities in Leiden, Netherlands from conducting excavations in Saqqara after the museum unveiled an exhibit about ancient Egyptian music that Egyptian authorities criticized for its Afrocentric depictions of certain figures, claiming it was historical negationism. (CNN) Disasters and accidents 2023 Canadian wildfires 2023 Central Canada wildfires, 2023 United States East Coast wildfire smoke Millions of people in the eastern United States and central Canada are warned to limit their time outdoors due to smoke and bad air quality from large wildfires in northern Ontario and Quebec. (Reuters via Yahoo! News) Officials in Chibougamau, Quebec, order 7,300 residents to evacuate in response to two nearby wildfires. (CBC News) Three people are killed by a 4.8 magnitude earthquake in Maubin, Ayeyarwady Region, Myanmar. (Ludunwayoo) Fifteen people are killed in a crash between a bus and a truck in Dakshin Surma Upazila, Sylhet District, Bangladesh. (IndianExpress)　 The Kīlauea volcano in Hawaii erupts after a 3-month pause, prompting evacuations. (AP) Politics and elections Doug Burgum 2024 presidential campaign Governor of North Dakota Doug Burgum announces his candidacy for President of the United States in 2024. (The Guardian) 2024 Salvadoran general election The Legislative Assembly of El Salvador votes to reduce the number of legislative seats from 84 to 60 ahead of the 2024 general election. (Reuters) Science and technology In a report published in Biology Letters, researchers reveal the first-known case of facultative parthenogenesis or a "virgin birth" in a crocodile, where a female American crocodile living in isolation at a Costa Rican zoo laid an egg of a fully formed stillborn crocodile that exhibited parthenogenesis. Researchers suggest that the findings provide insights into the reproduction of crocodile ancestors, including dinosaurs and pterosaurs. (USA Today) Prime Minister Rishi Sunak announces that the United Kingdom will host the world's first summit on artificial intelligence later this year. (The Philippine Star) Sports 2023 UEFA Europa Conference League final In association football, West Ham United defeat ACF Fiorentina 2–1 at the Fortuna Arena in Prague, Czech Republic, to win the 2022–23 UEFA Europa Conference League and qualify for the group stage of the 2023–24 UEFA Europa League. (BBC Sport)

---

RD: Lisl Steiner

Article: Lisl Steiner (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/en-espanol/espectaculos/gente/articulo/2023-06-07/muere-lisl-steiner-la-fotoperiodista-de-las-figuras-de-la-segunda-mitad-del-siglo-xx
Credits:

• Nominated by Onegreatjoke (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Photographer. Article looks alright Onegreatjoke (talk) 17:17, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) Canadian wildfires

Article: 2023 Canadian wildfires (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Wildfires in Canada cause evacuations and hazardous air conditions across North America. (Post)
News source(s): Reuters via Yahoo! News
Credits:

• Nominated by Morgan695 (talk · give credit)
• Created by NYMan6 (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: A similar blurb was nominated and closed on the 3rd, but has since become a much larger story – currently the top story on NYT, BBC, AP, etc. Morgan695 (talk) 19:40, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

can we include 2023 United States East Coast wildfire smoke Alexcs114 :) 20:00, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

That article is a stub and consensus appears to be trending towards merging all the offshoot articles into 2023 Canadian wildfires, so including it seems unnecessary. Morgan695 (talk) 20:13, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

@Morgan695 Me along with some users have also announced the merge, we find that article unnecessary and putting it into the main article is better information and content wise. NYMan6 (talk) 20:20, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

"By the night of June 6, New York City had the worst air pollution of any major city in the world; by the morning of June 7 it had fallen to second place." Wow, that is amazing. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 20:33, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

fair point, wasn't aware of the ongoing merge at the time Alexcs114 :) 20:56, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

"After a brief respite, New York City's air quality returned to being the worst of any major city in the world." Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 00:44, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose wildfires are common this time of year and this has yet to cause and deaths. Smoke from wildfires spread commonly across a wide area, and perhaps that this is a fire on the eastern side if the country may make it a curiosity, but it comes as part of wildfires in general. --Masem (t) 20:33, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  It's not really that time of year yet, the hottest month in that part of Canada is about July and trees take forever to dry out. One of the hottest late spring and early June heat waves ever recorded in parts of Canada gave fire season a head start. Fuel Moisture - Simply stated, the fuel moisture content of a fuel is the amount of water in that fuel, expressed as a percent of the ovendry weight of that fuel. If the fuel were totally dry, then the fuel moisture content would be zero percent. That being said, when a fuel has less than 30 percent moisture content, it is basically a dead fuel and is treated as such. Live fuels will range from 30 percent moisture content, to around 300 percent, depending on the plant's stage of growth in a season. When the fuel moisture content is high, fires ignite poorly, or not at all, because heat energy has to be used to evaporate and drive water from the plant before it can burn. When the fuel moisture content is low, fires start easily and will spread rapidly. All of the heat energy goes directly into the burning flame itself. Dead fuels respond solely to current environmental conditions (weather) and are critical in determining fire potential. The size of the fuel relates how fast the fuel will react to gains or losses in moisture due to changes in its environment. Therefore dead fuel moisture is classified by timelag and is defined as the amount of time it takes a fuel to reach two-third's of its way to equilibrium with its environment. One-hour timelag fuels are fuels which are less than 1/4 inch in diameter and respond very quickly to changes in their environment. These fuels will only take about an hour to lose or gain two-thirds of their equilibrium moisture content of their environment. This size fuel, if dead, is referred to as "fine dead fuel moisture" and is the most critical size fuel in starting fires. Moving up in size, a fuel will lose or gain moisture less rapidly through time. Ten hour fuels range in diameter from 1/4 inch to 1 inch, 100 hour fuels from 1 inch to 3 inches, and 1,000 hour fuels from 3 inches to 8 inches in diameter. 10,000 hour fuels are greater than 8 inches in diameter. Obviously, the 1,000 and 10,000 hour fuels do not burn easily. However, if they do burn, these size fuels will generate extreme heat often causing extreme fire behavior conditions. Fire has been known to smolder underneath snow pack through an entire winter when 10,000 hour fuels were on fire the summer before. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 20:59, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  yup, climate change

  Also I think that's the longest hyperlink I've ever seen. Like, ever Alexcs114 :) 21:03, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  The ultimate problem with this news item as it pertains to INT is that is relying on the "spectacle" of the wildfires, either from the standpoint if being the Xth largest fire in Canada, or that smoke from it affects the US eastern seaboard, or the NYC experienced its worst air quality from it. So what? With climate change we can anticipate these evens happening again and breaking records. This type of "wow, that's interesting" is great for a DYK blurb but not for ITN. Masem (t) 22:56, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support in principle due to its wide coverage but we should keep an eye on the multiple merges that are being discussed regarding this topic. Kafoxe (talk) 20:37, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  • Support overall I've been looking widely into the wildfires which are the most popular in the world, it is not very common for smoke to stretch so far that it affects school, benefits and daily lives of people from far. I've also checked info overall, and find it very amazing on what it is written on especially the one that @Sagittarian Milky Way mentioned. New York City itself is being highly affected by the smoke and fires, where I live in CT we can literally smell the fire, also not to mention that this is the biggest wildfire in Canada's history literally almost 10 million acres long (4,046,856 hectares). Overall I support the claims of support above and this is my decision. NYMan6 (talk) 20:43, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

SUPPORT - New York and surrounding areas haven't seen this level of wildfire-induced smoke and whatnot since.. well, I'm not sure - hence my point. Alexcs114 :) 20:57, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose The article has some issues. It says that the fires started in March and so the time frame seems quite protracted. And the article doesn't really explain what's happening. What exactly is causing these fires and why are they happening at this time? I thought this latitude was still affected by snow at this time. Rather than providing a good coherent explanation, the article seems scrappy and vague. Andrew🐉(talk) 21:03, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  Comment - It did start in March NYMan6 (talk) 21:15, 7 June 2023 (UTC) NYMan6 (talk) 21:15, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  The first 2023 fire in all Canada was in March, the first in Quebec and/or Ontario [[2023 Central Canada wildfires|was June 2nd]]? Most of the smoke in the east US is from Ontario and Quebec. The cause of the Ontario and Quebec fires is unseasonably high temperature and dryness and lightning. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 22:03, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  The article says nothing at all about lightning. The closest is comes to a cause is saying "Officials estimated about half of the province's wildfires were caused by human action."

  And the article doesn't explain the nature of the terrain or the fires. Is this forest, prairie, scrub, tundra or what? Canada is a huge place and the article seems to cover many provinces. My impression is that the main phenomenon is a widespread dry spell or drought and so fires are a secondary consequence rather than being the primary topic. As North America has had drought on the west coast for some time and lots of wild fires there, this just seems to be more of the same.

  Andrew🐉(talk) 09:36, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  2023 Central Canada wildfires says lightning, most of the East US smoke is from Quebec, not the west. There's wildfire in every province and territory except Nunavut and that Prince Edward Island, some wildfire in West Canada is prairie, there's forest fires almost coast-to-coast and almost USA to "the territories" AKA north of 60, I don't know about tundra. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 13:49, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  First, as to snow still in March at that latitude (varies sharply by longitude as well, but focused on mid-northern Ontario / Quebec) -- it's supposed to be. A lot of Canada had an extremely low-snow winter this year. Some places barely got any snow at all, places that normally have upward of two metres of snow. Second, technically not drought yet in central Canada, because of significant rain in April -- most farmers are not yet concerned -- but very very dry. Other parts of Canada are even drier. The Alberta and northern fires continue and are causing local air quality issues, but those are not the ones causing the current east coast smoke re this nomination. - Tenebris 66.11.165.101 (talk) 16:51, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Thanks for the info but the article doesn't explain this and so its quality is still poor. I took another look to check after the posting. The first section is about Alberta and it tells us that their state of emergency ended 5 days ago. So, that's stale already. The rule seems to be that it doesn't matter how much of Canada is affected but if NYC gets a whiff then we stop the presses. Andrew🐉(talk) 17:19, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Article isn't in any condition to be on the main page. Noah^Talk 21:06, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Oppose - Article quality is bad Onegreatjoke (talk) 22:07, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Damn!

Strong support - as the one who initially nominated this story a few days ago, I stand by my original nom comment: this is an extraordinary and historic event that is rippling throughout Anglo-America (look at the smoke in NY for christ's sake, damn!). The article quality is not the best, but I'm not sure why people are acting like its any worse than some of the disaster stubs that we frequently post. The event has received sustained coverage as well. - Knightoftheswords281 (Talk · Contribs) 01:08, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

The coverage is 100% from the systematic media bias of North American news sources. There's little else of interest on this side of the world, so "omg bad air quality in NYC!" is making headlines. Masem (t) 02:00, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Comment - Several of the sources used are international sources, as well. This wildfire could literally be reported across the world right now, not to mention the notability that I have seen of the event on social media. More than 100 million people in alert in the U.S with millions more in Canada and the events small smokes spreading to Europe and not to mention even evacuation and school closure. Seems enough. NYMan6 (talk) 02:14, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Even the Women's NBA is going to wait for the weather cause the smoke went indoors. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 02:49, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Comment for @Knightoftheswords281: It's not even bad tbh, it's literally a growing article, its better than several disaster stubs and other's this is an event current, information grows people don't understand. NYMan6 (talk) 02:08, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Most significant wildfire story for a while. Historic scenes in the northeastern United States. GWA88 (talk) 02:12, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Wide coverage, and unprecedented effects on parts of Canada and the US.ARandomName123 (talk) 02:41, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support Currently front page news on most major news outlets globally. Its the lead story in Le Monde. Article quality is acceptable, and sourcing is actually decent. -Ad Orientem (talk) 02:48, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support Massive news coverage, unprecedented effect. Article looks pretty solid. The Kip (talk) 03:37, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose — Per Masem. U.S.-centric news story. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 03:55, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  And Canada, where the damage is taking place. DrewieStewie (talk) 04:41, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  “Please do not… Oppose an item solely because the event is only relating to a single country, or failing to relate to one. This applies to a high percentage of the content we post and is generally unproductive.“ The Kip (talk) 04:49, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

@ElijahPepe: And Canadians get very angry when you treat them as negligible this way because they're next door to us ... Don't let them fool you with how nice they generally are. Daniel Case (talk) 05:07, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Am Canadian; can confirm. Overlook us at your own peril. 🔥🍁🔥 Kurtis ^(talk) 14:16, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

all of the other current "in the news" stories are all centric to one country, this is a bit of a silly reason to oppose IMO. Alexcs114 :) 07:03, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

The only time anyone ever argues that the story is only relevant to one country is when it involves the US, I'm really not sure why, but I wish comments that only have that argument would be struck out, as it's not a valid argument. Especially in this case... since it's relevant to two countries, not one. --Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 08:37, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Per @Alexcs114 it's stupid that the opposition calls this centric, when in reality almost every article put onto it literally is centric to one country. NYMan6 (talk) 10:36, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support on quality and significance. DrewieStewie (talk) 04:42, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support and not just because this has been my life for the last two days (I'm only so unfazed by it because, as I was telling people, I had seen and breathed much worse air on a visit to China in 2014, but then the AQI around where I live broke 200 today as New York City's broke 400, the latter equivalent to the day I was wandering around Beijing and visiting the Temple of Heaven (see photo)). To say that this shouldn't be on ITN because it will happen again due to climate change is not only a bit CRYSTAL but also discounts the significance of this being the first time this sort of natural disaster has happened in a well-populated, globally important region where this sort of thing has never happened in recorded history (save maybe this exception). To analogize it ... Houston having a 100ºF+ heatwave is not unusual enough to be ITN-worthy; London having one is (at this point in time). Likewise if 10 inches of wet snow falls in my neck of the woods, I wouldn't even think of nominating it for ITN, but you can bet that if that happened in Singapore I'd support the nomination.

  And, by further analogy, should we not have put the Russian invasion of Ukraine in ITN because it could be considered likely that Russia will invade other neighboring countries in the future? Daniel Case (talk) 05:07, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• London had a heatwave of over 100ºF last year – see European heat wave & wildfires. I recorded a temperature of over 120ºF myself and I expect it will be similar this year. It's going to be a long hot summer all over because of El Niño and so we're going to have lots of weather stories. It's perhaps something for Ongoing. Andrew🐉(talk) 09:53, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  England north of 53 even had 105! Well 104.54 plus or minus 0.09F AKA 0.05C. And Greater London had 104.36. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 13:59, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose serious wildfires in Canada are not really unusual. Serious wildfires are not unusual anymore. And no victims have been reported. _-_Alsor (talk) 05:20, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  In Eastern Canada it is. They have fires but not like this. Maybe 1780 was last time? Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 14:05, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support on both quality and importance – this is the headline of many credible news organizations now (and isn't that the essence of ITN?). And this is not just US-centric as this obviously came from Canada; the effects in the US are more of a "side effect" of the ongoing wildfires in Canada, which is arguably the one that got hit more badly. I also think the 2023 United States East Coast wildfire smoke article should also be part of the blurb, unless it gets merged with the 2023 Canadian wildfires article itself. Vida0007 (talk) 06:35, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support - It's pretty clear that this is a big deal and is being reported internationally. I fail to see any convincing argument as to why this shouldn't be posted. Most of the arguments against posting this seem to be the usual argument that this is only relevant to the US... but most stories we post are only relevant to one country (which is why ITN implores people to not use that as an argument), and besides that, this is actually relevant to two countries, as Canada is suffering even more than the US is. --Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 08:34, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Similar to the last nom, the kernel of the news story are the wildfires in Canada which editors clearly demonstrated, in the last nom, are not that uncommon. That the smoke of the fire affected nearby regions is a non-story. Gotitbro (talk) 10:04, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  If it's a non-story then why is it being internationally covered? Alexcs114 :) 10:17, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Sensationalism, media bias. Gotitbro (talk) 12:23, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Not our job to determine that, really - seems WP:OR. If it's in the news, it's in the news and we should note it as such. Alexcs114 :) 13:08, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  If we followed the way all international media promotes stories with no other criteria in significance, we wold be flooded with US and UK politics and other Western centric stories. Which is we ITN is not a news ticker, we employ some degree of significance based on a topic being and enduring or impact fully, and not day to day curiosities the media sees. Masem (t) 13:13, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  East Canada is rarer than West Canada. This amount of wildfire smoke is NOT normal in East North America. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 14:08, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Wildfires are common and what makes this one unique is the air current carrying the smoke over a populated area, nothing more. With the smoke expected to clear in the next day or two I see don't much benefit covering this story for wiki readers. Kcmastrpc (talk) 10:54, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Comment - I'm kind of bewildered by the oppose !votes here. I think we look really silly right now. If we don't post this wildfire, which one are we going to post? A wildfire across the entire North American continent from coast-to-coast? --Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 12:27, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Seriously, we're missing the big picture through all the smoke. The real news story is the amount of damage the fires in Canada, which have been ongoing since March, measured in hectares as well as any damage they have done. The smoke is an unusual side effect, but it is absolutely temporary, and only a spectacle in the media because the eastern seaboard doesn't usually see wildfires and the effect of smoke. But right now the blurb is focused on this. I can tell you that people in the Pacific Northwest would scoff at the level of concern, given that they just had a similar issue with smoke and air quality from fires in B.C. This story is making a big deal out of nothing or actually burying the lede about the serious threat of the wildfires. And if we focused on the wildfires, they have been ongoing since March and thus would be considered stale. an ongoing line would not be appropriate as wildfires are happening all over the globe, and this is nowhere near how large they have been in the past. Masem (t) 12:33, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  That's a valid point, thus why I didn't rush to support this. Still, I'm nonetheless unimpressed by votes such as "U.S.-centric news story." when, as you pointed out, the main damage being done is in Canada. --Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 13:01, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Because the lede ( Canada wildfires) is being buried by the spectacle (smoke along us eastern seaboard). We should be evaluating the lede story here, and in a grand scale of things, these are not any significant wildfires, yet, and part and parcel for this tome of year and other climate conditions. Masem (t) 13:16, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  This would only be part and parcel to West North America and it's a bit early for that. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 14:21, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Except this year. West started early this year. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 14:22, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  We have a very well established standard of posting "common event but uncommon for this location" like mass shootings, terrorism, natural disasters, etc. I thinks its a dumb practice and have voiced my opposition many times but been shouted down. It is unquestionably an unusual event enrapturing the capital of the world; we shouldn't dismiss that because people in Oregon are used to it. GreatCaesarsGhost 13:07, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  The Quebec and Ontario ones started June 2 and are as little as 10 miles from Montreal suburbs. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 14:19, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support - multi-national impact, largest wildfires in Canadian history, worst air quality in North America's second largest city on record, and widely covered. Masem's long running crusade against the news media's supposed sensationalism aside (one that I thought was rejected in his straw poll?), this is clearly a widely covered news story with significant impact across a large region. nableezy - 13:07, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Any story which rests on "the largest.. " or "the worst..." or other superlatives, particularly when climate change is information, are ones that could easily be outdone in a year or even a few days. We look to long term impact here. And in relation to the straw poll, while newsworthiness is a factor, there is also still a significance factor to consider, which is this itnc debate right now. Masem (t) 13:21, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Yes, any record can be broken later. That does not change their significance when they are broken now. The sourcing and the depth of coverage, and how wide that coverage is, here demonstrates the significance. If in the unlikely chance this fire gets put down and an even larger one appears in a few days Id support that too. But since that remains an absurdly unlikely hypothetical, how about we focus on this current event that is indeed the largest wildfire in Canada's history and causing significant impact in a very highly populated area? nableezy - 14:03, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Not always true, i.e. it would've taken years and years for another plane model to beat the Airbus A380 as world's largest passenger plane and it was too big for existing airports to deal with, it's not something that can be designed, prototyped, tested, certificated, delivered and introduced into service in a year. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 14:33, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Also even more so the longest total solar eclipse of the 21st century (2009) isn't something that could just be beat next year. They know all the eclipse lengths many centuries in advance. Sagittarian Milky Way (talk) 14:38, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Marked as Ready The discussion has been open a sufficient period of time and there appears to be a rough consensus in favor of posting. -Ad Orientem (talk) 13:45, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support This is a no-brainer really – huge coverage with international impact.-- Pawnkingthree (talk) 13:47, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support—I previously opposed a blurb nomination for the wildfires taking place in Nova Scotia, believing that the situation was being resolved. However, the wildfires have continued to spread, and it has become a major news event. I believe it is now significant enough for the main page. Kurtis ^(talk) 14:10, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Posted Solid article, of wide interest especially in the Northeastern U.S., opposition cites a lack of deaths and international scope which aren't appropriate arguments to me. – Muboshgu (talk) 14:42, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  @Muboshgu: I saw you protected the satellite image. Personally think the Earth image of NYC at File:Empire State Building on June 7, 2023.jpg (mentioned above) might be more comprehendible, given the display size. —Bagumba (talk) 15:23, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  I agree. – Muboshgu (talk) 15:26, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Image posted. Anyone more creative can suggest caption improvements at WP:ERRORS, as needed.—Bagumba (talk) 16:08, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  This was the right call, I think. Even if the original event is pretty well and truly stale, it meets all four forks of the DICE standard. There's no shortage of coverage of the wildfire in the news, the impact and consequences are massive in that hundreds of thousands of citizens -- if not millions -- are being impacted by the wildfire in some capacity, and the encyclopedic nature of it is indicated by the fact we're receiving multiple quality updates to the aforementioned articles. Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 15:58, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  @WaltCip: No... it's more like 10s of millions to a hundred million+. Anyways... Support on significance. Noah^Talk 17:20, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Post-posting support - Most certainly the right call, given the scope, scale, and significance of the wildfires and the opinions above. Fires of this type are not "common," with NYC currently one of the most polluted cities on Earth as a result and 100 million people in North America coping with the effects. - Fuzheado | Talk 16:47, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Comment Re the comments about just affecting one (or two) countries. First, as previously noted, that reason for opposition is inherently not valid by ITN terms. Second, This story is newsworthy based on the population and/or the geographical area being affected. In N. America, that happens to involve two countries, both of which are exceptionally large (Canada 2nd in the world, U.S. 4th). This unusual layout tends to distort the real scale of the impact. Take the exact same issue and overlay it on Europe, S. America, Africa, or (non-Russia) Asia, and then consider how many countries it would have affected had the main body of N. America been laid out politically like other continents. (Wildfire smoke does not respect political boundaries.) - Tenebris 66.11.165.101 (talk) 17:34, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Therein lies an issue with weighing "global significance" w.r.t. number of countries as a posting criteria. —Bagumba (talk) 18:01, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  yeah, like if Luxembourg and the Netherlands have a new trade agreement, it'd technically be international but at the same time not at all significant Alexcs114 :) 18:29, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

RD: The Iron Sheik

Article: The Iron Sheik (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): MSN
Credits:

• Nominated by Fakescientist8000 (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Iranian wrestler for WWE. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 16:47, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose on quality RIP bubba, but there's some wholly uncited sections. The Kip (talk) 19:31, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

June 6

Portal:Current events/2023 June 6

June 6, 2023 (2023-06-06) (Tuesday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine Destruction of the Kakhovka Dam The Nova Kakhovka dam in the Russian-occupied part of Ukraine's Kherson Oblast is destroyed, releasing a huge amount of water downstream on the Dnieper. The dam had held back 18 cubic kilometres of water in the Kakhovka reservoir. (Reuters) Thousands of civilians are being evacuated from the town of Nova Kakhovka and surrounding villages as the floods spread. (BBC News) Afghan conflict, Islamic State–Taliban conflict The deputy governor of Afghanistan's Badakhshan Province and his driver are killed and six civilians injured when a suicide car bomber rams their vehicle in Fayzabad. (DW) Iran unveils a domestically produced hypersonic long-range missile named "Fattah", which they claim can penetrate missile defense systems. (Al Jazeera) Disasters and accidents Three people are killed and 36 others injured by a 4.9 magnitude earthquake in Jérémie, Grand'Anse, Haiti. (ABC News) Law and crime 2023 Richmond shooting Two people are killed and five others injured after a mass shooting at Huguenot High School in Richmond, Virginia, United States. (Reuters) Kidnapping and killing of Jee Ick-Joo A court in Angeles, Philippines, convicts a police officer and an official of the National Bureau of Investigation in connection with the kidnapping and murder of South Korean businessman Jee Ick-Joo in 2016. However, the alleged mastermind of the plot is acquitted. (Philippine Daily Inquirer) Regulation of electronic cigarettes The New Zealand government announces a ban on most disposable electronic cigarettes from August. (The Guardian) Five people are killed and eight others injured when police open fire on taxi drivers protesting against high fuel prices in Huambo, Angola. At least 34 others were arrested during the protest, which was in response to the government's decision to cut fuel subsidies. (News24) Sports The professional golf tour organisations LIV Golf, the PGA Tour and the PGA European Tour announce that they will combine their commercial rights into a new for-profit company, primarily funded by Saudi Arabia's Public Investment Fund. This merger agreement will end all existing litigation between the three tours, with plans for a "fair and objective process for any players who wish to re-apply for membership". (Sky Sports)

---

RD: John McCoy (American politician)

Article: John McCoy (American politician) (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://lynnwoodtimes.com/2023/06/06/john-mccoy-230606/
Credits:

• Nominated by Onegreatjoke (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American Politician. It almost looks ready, aside from an uncited sentence. Onegreatjoke (talk) 16:56, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

RD: Árni Johnsen

Article: Árni Johnsen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.ruv.is/frettir/innlent/2023-06-07-arni-johnsen-er-latinn
Credits:

• Nominated by Onegreatjoke (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Icelandic politician. Article looks alright and it can be expanded from the icelandic wiki if it's too small. Onegreatjoke (talk) 16:48, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

(Ready) RD: William Spriggs

Article: William Spriggs (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): [1]
Credits:

• Nominated by Muboshgu (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 – Muboshgu (talk) 22:15, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Article looks solid and well referenced. No issues. -Ad Orientem (talk) 03:25, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support per Ad Orientem. Article is good enough for ITNRD. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 12:53, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

(Ready) RD: Françoise Gilot

Article: Françoise Gilot (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): NYT
Credits:

• Nominated by Gerda Arendt (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Strattonsmith (talk · give credit) and Fakescientist8000 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: 101, muse of Picasso for 10 years, but an artist in her own right, - only much of work was lost in WWII. The article looks in good shape but for 2 ref tags. I thought I better bring it here than search alone. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:03, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support I have fixed the two CN tags. Article looks good enough (good sourcing plus long enough to not be stubby) for ITNRD. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 22:15, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support, Article is good and has enough information for ITN. Alex-h (talk) 13:18, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support G2G. -Ad Orientem (talk) 15:09, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Nikolai Denkov becomes PM of Bulgaria

Article: Nikolai Denkov (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Nikolai Denkov becomes Prime Minister of Bulgaria. (Post)
News source(s): Radio Free Europe, Yahoo/Reuters.
Credits:

• Nominated by Kacamata (talk · give credit)
• Created by Vjr2f98j (talk · give credit)

The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.

Nominator's comments: Article needs some work, but the news are worth notice. Kacamata! ^Dimmi!!! 21:40, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose on quality as article doesn't mention him becoming PM, and is also quite small. That said, as the Bulgarian PM administers the executive, this is ITNR. The Kip (talk) 21:45, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose on quality per issues brought up by The Kip, but the article is ITN/R. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 22:08, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support, following the updates I've just made to the article in order to mention this key event. @Kacamata, The Kip, and Fakescientist8000: Let me know if these additions can help improve the page as a whole; also, here is one more potentially useful source, should you have time to add it. Oltrepier (talk) 19:14, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Weak Oppose Article quality is really subpar for such a major political figure. -Ad Orientem (talk) 03:27, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

PGA Tour and LIV Golf to merge

Articles: PGA Tour (talk · history · tag) and LIV Golf (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ In golf, the PGA Tour and LIV Golf agree to a merger, ending their pending litigation. (Post)
News source(s): CNBC, NY Times
Credits:

• Nominated by Muboshgu (talk · give credit)

Both articles updated

Nominator's comments: Rare sports business news – Muboshgu (talk) 15:23, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose — Business news is unsuitable for ITN. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 15:53, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  WP:ITN says The "In the news" (ITN) section on the Main Page serves to direct readers to articles that have been substantially updated to reflect recent or current events of wide interest. It doesn't say except for business news, which is unsuitable, as an entire genre of news isn't disqualified. This is also international news as LIV is owned by the Saudi Public Investment Fund. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:31, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  @ElijahPepe Completely categorically untrue! Do you want me to cite the numerous instances in which we have posted business news? I'd be more than happy to look them up for you. Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 13:22, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  WP:OTHERSTUFF. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 15:41, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  Sir, respectfully, you were the one who argued WP:OTHERSTUFFDOESNTEXIST. Your argument is incorrect on the basis that it does not reflect the current consensus of ITN. We have posted, and will continue to post, business mergers, collapses, and acquisitions of various sizes as recently as 2022. If you're going to oppose something for silly reasons, you better at least have a bloody good silly reason instead of making up false rationales. Otherwise you just come across as trolling. Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 15:57, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  The argument that you're making is that, because other business news has appeared on ITN, this article is somehow notable. If we considered every single merger that graced the cover of The New York Times, half of ITN would be nothing but business news. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 16:08, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  At what point in the above exchange did I say "this event is notable because we've posted other business news before"? Please cite that statement or else tear down your straw man argument. Also, could another admin please hat this before one of us gets sent to ANI. Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 16:16, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  Wait, that's not what is being said. It's much simpler. You said: "Business news is unsuitable for ITN". That is objectively incorrect, policy-wise and practice-wise. Might I suggest we chalk that up as your opinion, and agree to disagree. - Fuzheado | Talk 16:18, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  OTHERSTUFF is Wikipedia:Arguments to avoid in deletion discussions. This is ITN. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:00, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose for right now DP World Tour needs included, as they are part of the merger. However, something like this golf wise hasn't happened since the actual PGA Tour split from the PGA in the late 1960s. TheCorriynial (talk) 16:42, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose. Failed attempt to challenge the business structure of golf ends after 12 months. LIV never seriously challenged PGA and their merger simply returns things to the status quo of pre-2022. Modest Genius ^talk 16:54, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  The PGA Tour did not have billions of Saudi dollars invested into it, so this is not "returning to the status quo". – Muboshgu (talk) 17:09, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  Sure, but if the Saudis had simply made an investment into PGA we wouldn't consider that blurb-worthy. Modest Genius ^talk 11:19, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  But that type of investment wasn't possible with the PGA [2]. I'm unclear how this what-if scenario is useful for ITN determination. - Fuzheado | Talk 17:12, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  I would suggest this is the very opposite of failing to challenge PGA Tour. Liv was perceived as a realistic existential threat to the established order, and PGA & DP were doing what it could to prevent that from happening. If Liv truly failed, PGA & DP wouldn't have had to agree a merger, they would have just let it die. -- KTC (talk) 17:31, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  PGA had a dominant sporting competition, LIV had bucket loads of cash. Both sides wanted what the other had, and running two separate tours was damaging to both. Of course they were going to merge, the only surprise is it happened in just 12 months. Modest Genius ^talk 11:19, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  That is not borne out by the facts in the reporting. There was surprise the merger was happening at all because of the PGA's previous principled stance, and the "hypocrisy" of now doing a deal with LIV. [3] [4] [5] [6] Therefore the time frame was not the only "surprise." - Fuzheado | Talk 17:20, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  As news about this has emerged, this observation seems incomplete. The reporting have made a bigger deal about this, both the straight news and opinion pieces, where the Saudi Public Investment Fund is at the heart of the issue. So this becomes not just a sport story, but a business and human rights story. Headlines include:

  • ‘Gigantic victory for sportswashing’: old truths will haunt golf’s new dawn (Guardian UK)
  • LIV Golf-PGA Tour merger reignites not-so-clean debate over sportswashing (Washington Post)
  • PGA Tour sold out to LIV Golf and the Saudis. Pro golf will never be the same. - "From top to bottom, they own professional golf now." (USA Today)
  • With PGA-LIV merger, the sportswashing of Saudi Arabia's human rights record is in full swing (Deadspin)
  • The PGA Tour’s Grim, Blockbuster Merger (Slate)

  Regardless of whether this is enough to change anyone's opinion here, a !vote that doesn't consider this dynamic affects the evaluation of consensus. - Fuzheado | Talk 10:29, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  I am aware of the (justified) criticism of where the money has come from, however it was already being spent on golf. Whether that cash is going to an independent LIV or to a merged PGA-LIV won't make any material difference to human rights, in Saudia Arabia or elsewhere. Modest Genius ^talk 11:19, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose At least the World Hockey Association made it a full year. LIV was too short-lived to make this notable news. Teemu08 (talk) 16:55, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  Um, they're in their second season right now, not that it being too "short-lived" somehow makes this not notable. I don't want to WP:BLUDGEON this thread but accuracy matters. – Muboshgu (talk) 17:10, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Weak Oppose but not because of any of the reasons given above. I'm actually open to the ITN'ness of this. The issue I have is that the agreement is only at the stage of an initial board agreement and non-binding. There's still a lot that can cause the merger not to go ahead. While it is in the news now and may not be later, given the bad feelings with each other in the golf world, I'm not sure we should post something that have reasonable probability of not going ahead. -- KTC (talk) 17:28, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  I'm not trying to get you to change your mind, but this type of news story usually receives attention when it is announced, not when the documents are finalized, the regulators approve, or other formalities occur. Perhaps in this specific case there are reasons to doubt it will go ahead, but it more than likely will not get more attention than it does now. 331dot (talk) 19:49, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support (changed from neutral) now that the scope and significance have emerged. This is not just a "ho hum" or routine story, as it is a significant shift into the control of the only global franchise for the sport of golf, which is international, and massive in terms of dollar amount and influence. It is also a geopolitical story that merits posting on ITN, where both articles have seen a surge of traffic. [7] Neutral but open to support. Agree with Muboshgu that this is a signficant story in terms of sport and business, but also geopolitics, given the parties invovled. [8] Business news has always been and will always be suitable for ITN. However, as KTC points out, posting "mergers" here is always tricky - do we post when it's announced, when it's official, when shareholders approve, or when it actually happens (given it's even possible to know it happened), etc? Concur with TheCorriynial that any posting should include DP World tour/European PGA as part of it. – Fuzheado | Talk 19:51, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support. I would contend this is larger news then the individual results of any of the ITN golf items we have, and this is probably the biggest golf news in quite some time. DarkSide830 (talk) 22:33, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  I would agree with this assessment and also support. The media coverage is certainly there, and it was even the lead headline on NY Times for much of the day. Kicking222 (talk) 02:20, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Pretty monumental (albeit depressing) news in the golf world. The Kip (talk) 23:12, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per Modest Genius. _-_Alsor (talk) 05:26, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  MG’s argument is conceptually incorrect, so I’m not exactly sure doubling down on it is strong reasoning. The Kip (talk) 07:23, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  Compared to yours? Mind your manners. GreatCaesarsGhost 15:46, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  Do better. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 14:24, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Front page news. Hawkeye7 (discuss) 07:47, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose. No doubt this is big news in golfing circles, but at the level of a global general encyclopedia, it's not significant enough for us to post. As Modest Genius points out, this was rather a flash-in-the-pan and the ultimate net effect of this is limited, Saudi dollars notwithstanding. It seems it will be back to business as usual.  — Amakuru (talk) 07:58, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support - Certainly a topic fitting for a global encyclopedia. It's a big business merger that has a significant impact on the two aforementioned articles. --Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 13:21, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support A sport story that's on the front page of all the newspapers, not the back one. Any blurb should of course include the PGA European Tour, not just the PGA and LIV. Black Kite (talk) 14:12, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per Modest Genius. I agree that the machinations make for a salacious read, but this so-called "merger" is masquerading the ho-hum story of yet another startup sports league folding in under a year. GreatCaesarsGhost 15:46, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support A different kind of story that is very large in its field, and would be of interest to readers. Kafoxe (talk) 20:34, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose, Not suitable for ITN Alex-h (talk) 13:13, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  This comment isn't helpful to reviewers without knowing why you feel that way. 331dot (talk) 13:36, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support This is probably not going to get posted, but it should. It's a really major news story globally and it involves multiple subject areas, sports, business, and law. -Ad Orientem (talk) 15:12, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  It really should be. It's just a shame that the significance bar really is all over the place (and there's no option to fact-check !votes). If it's front page news in multiple papers and it results in significant updates to multiple Wikipedia articles, it ought to be newsworthy enough, I would think. Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 15:56, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  ...and there's no option to fact-check !votes... How would it realistically work?—Bagumba (talk) 16:45, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  Walt has been here long enough to know that significance is in the eye of the beholder. You can certainly discount votes that make no real case or only invoke "banned" rationale, but implying others opinions are false is bad faith. GreatCaesarsGhost 17:56, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support - widely covered sports and business news. See nothing in the opposes that trump the front page coverage. nableezy - 16:35, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

  "See nothing in the opposes that trump the front page coverage" - the way ITN runs at the moment, front page coverage doesn't immediately imply we'd run it. The story is assessed on its encyclopedic significance in a global encyclopedia, rather than the things that would routinely appear on a "news ticker". Now I don't necessarily agree with that approach, I'd rather we post more news stories that readers want to find and for which we have decent articles, but we've yet to gather consensus for such a change at WT:ITN. And given the calibre of story we routinely don't post, I don't think this golfing one rises to any extent higher than those, and it would be wrong and systemically biased to post this.  — Amakuru (talk) 17:18, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) Nova Kakhovka dam blown up

Articles: Destruction of the Kakhovka Dam (talk · history · tag) and Kakhovka Hydroelectric Power Plant (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ The Nova Kakhovka dam has been blown up, releasing a large amount of water downstream (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ The Kakhovka Dam is breached causing flooding and threatening the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant
Alternative blurb II: ​ The Kakhovka Dam in Ukraine breaches, causing flooding and prompting mass evacuations.
News source(s): The Guardian
Credits:

• Nominated by Count Iblis (talk · give credit)

Article updated

 Count Iblis (talk) 04:22, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Wait -- I will Support this once this starts being discussed more broadly in the news. However, at this time, it has yet to have gotten sustained media attention (probably because the west is mostly asleep at this hour). --Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 04:38, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  It was a "breaking news" item on New Zealand's Newshub 6 pm news show. Schwede66 07:41, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  Yes, Post-posting support, now. Thank you @Count Iblis: for proposing this blurb. -- Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 20:28, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose for now Covered by ongoing - also far too premature coverage or impact-wise. The Kip (talk) 05:10, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• It's not covered by the ongoing article which has zero content about this. Even if the ongoing article had an update, it would be difficult to find as that article is so huge now. Andrew🐉(talk) 12:11, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose as it’s covered by the ongoing item.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 05:57, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Wait - I feel like this could become an extremely significant event, though we will have to wait and see. Onegreatjoke (talk) 06:19, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support but wait pending the clear (likely impossible) indication of who did it. I agree with what Onegreatjoke said, this could potentially have significant impact. --Ouro (blah blah) 06:31, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Comment Destruction of the Kakhovka Dam is currently a stub.—Bagumba (talk) 07:39, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support eventually once more details are known and the stub article mentioned above is expandable. Also, the blurb needs work, but no rush on that. ansh.666 07:46, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support. The destruction of a major piece of civilian infrastruture would be a war crime if carried out by a party to the conflict(Russia had possession and was documented to have mined the facility, though I don't believe the perpetrator has been independently identified yet). Even if we don't want to get into that, its loss will have a major impact on hundreds of thousands of people(aside from Ukraine itself, it supplied water to Crimea, and threatens a nuclear power plant that uses its water) and this should be a no brainer. 331dot (talk) 08:55, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Consistency oppose - either we post notable developments in the war even if it's covered by ongoing, or we don't. Since we have historically chosen the latter, we should also not post this. Banedon (talk) 09:01, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  Consensus can change. What you propose is a recipe to change nothing ever. 331dot (talk) 09:23, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

There are reasons independent of the war to post this. If Hoover Dam or the Grand Coulee Dam were breached, we would post it. 331dot (talk) 09:25, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

If this results in a nuclear disaster, we should make an exception and post it. However, a lot of other infrastructure has been damaged or fully destroyed during the invasion (see 2022–2023 Russian strikes against Ukrainian infrastructure), so there's no reason to single this out while the invasion is posted onto ongoing.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 09:51, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

We posted both the Crimean bridge explosion, and the Russian annexation of Donetsk/Luhansk/Kherson/Zaporizhzhia, if I recall correctly. DecafPotato (talk) 16:32, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support We have posted significant developments before such as the sinking of the Moskva. There is therefore good precedent. Andrew🐉(talk) 09:30, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Ongoing exists for a reason, for the same similar destruction has not been posted before. A lot of significance is being put into its supposed impact on nuclear installations (WP:CRYSTALBALL), we can discuss if and when that actually happens. Gotitbro (talk) 10:08, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  It's not crystal balling that there are and could be impacts to the NPP. The head of the IAEA has spoken about this extensively. 331dot (talk) 12:53, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Similar destruction has been posted before: Crimean Bridge explosion --Mika1h (talk) 10:35, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Wait. I think this has the potential to merit a separate blurb, but it's still too soon to determine what the impacts will be. By tomorrow we'll have a better idea of how widespread the flooding was, whether it compromises the nuclear power plant etc. The article is developing nicely but is still a first draft and there's no rush to post. Modest Genius ^talk 11:22, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Wait - This is of potentially extreme significance, but as indicated above, we won't know until the consequences of this disaster become more well known. --Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 12:47, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Wait 24h - Per above, this is likely going to have significant ramifications but as of right now the downstream impact is occluded by the fog of war. Kcmastrpc (talk) 12:52, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Support major escalatory act of war crime levels. We've posted the sinking of the Moskva and the Crimean bridge explosion. Eight communities have already been flooded and is likely to affect the water supply in Crimea and local habitats. The fact that this has already occurred is evidence that this is not crystalballing. - Knightoftheswords281 (Talk · Contribs) 17:57, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

I think we need to amend the blurb to give a numerical estimate of how many people are affected; deaths or displacements. "Mass displacements" simply isn't convincing enough, we should have a number of people affected. Does such an estimate exist? QueensanditsCrazy (talk) 00:55, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose. I disagree with the current wording and I believe Russia should be explictly attributed for it. There are concerns of WP:FALSEBALANCE in the main article and I think the current situation contributes to this perception. Super Ψ Dro 13:46, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Wait untill impact becomes clear. NW1223<Howl at me•My hunts> 14:02, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Wait currently leaning oppose. Generally, I have opposed nominations related to the war as major events are covered in ongoing. But there is a chance this could turn into something really big. -Ad Orientem (talk) 14:05, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support anyway, it's a major disaster, that significantly changes the physical geography of the area. --Jenda H. (talk) 15:34, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support. Not covered by ongoing. Shanes (talk) 15:56, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Wait. Full environmental impacts and humanitarian impacts are not fully known as of now, and precise information is still not readily available. 2G0o2De0l (talk) 16:11, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Oppose, covered by ongoing. ONly support if it becomes a larger humanitarian disaster, like it actually causes deaths. For now, it's crystal ball to me. QueensanditsCrazy (talk) 16:14, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support per Jenda H. above. Would have been ITN-material even without the war, which just adds to it. Yakikaki (talk) 16:30, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support Already newsworthy enough IMO, without even waiting for further developments. 70.181.1.68 (talk) 17:47, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support - Should be posted. As a major event within this invasion.BabbaQ (talk) 18:19, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support, the destruction of the dam is a major event and possible war crime. CJ-Moki (talk) 18:54, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Posted – given the high profile coverage by all the major news outlets and that this is an ecological [9] and humanitarian [10] disaster in itself, even outside the context of the Russia-Ukraine conflict. - Fuzheado | Talk 19:08, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support I see where the thoughts around 'this is covered by ongoing' are coming from, but the dam breach appears to be an ongoing singular disaster of unusual scope that deserves a separate blurb. An estimated 40,000 people on both Ukrainian- and Russian-controlled land are in the flood zone, and 17,000 people are already being evacuated on the Ukrainian side. Ed ^{[talk] [majestic titan]} 19:23, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Pull. I think it's way too early to have this item posted not knowing the full scope of impacts. To this point, all we know if is evacuations and speculative impacts, neither of which I'd argue merits ITN posting. DarkSide830 (talk) 22:39, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Blurb workshop
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
Blurb workshop I'm inclined to post this, given the high profile coverage by all the major news outlets and that this is a disaster in itself, even outside the context of the Russia-Ukraine conflict. However, the current blurbs seem inadequate. Starting this section so we can help converge on a desirable wording. These are the current options: blurb - The Nova Kakhovka dam has been blown up, releasing a large amount of water downstream. altblurb1 - The Kakhovka Dam is breached causing flooding and threatening the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant. altblurb2 - The Kakhovka Dam in Ukraine breaches, causing flooding and prompting mass evacuations. – Fuzheado | Talk 18:15, 6 June 2023 (UTC) altblurb3: In Ukraine, the Kakhovka Dam is breached, causing flooding and prompting mass evacuations. – Fuzheado | Talk 18:38, 6 June 2023 (UTC) Posted version: In Ukraine, the Kakhovka Dam (pictured) is breached, causing flooding and prompting mass evacuations. Fuzheado | Talk 19:27, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Post-Posting Oppose I know this is futile by now, but it is covered by ongoing. Editor 5426387 (talk) 20:17, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Pull Besides being covered my ongoing, there haven't been any reported casualties, and I'm not sure there will be much lasting impact. I could also argue that there was no consensus to post in the first place. -- Kicking222 (talk) 23:14, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  I'm sorry, but I have to respond here. "No lasting impact"? Even if the war is over tomorrow, and somone start rebuilding the dam immediately, the ecological and humanitarian impact of what happened here is going to last years or decades. -- KTC (talk) 23:21, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  I agree with you that there will undoubtedly be some lasting impact, and perhaps I should have included the word "broad", but the number of people displaced (note that I am in no way making light of the situation- losing your property in a flood sucks, having worse access to water sucks, war sucks) is nowhere near the level of some other elements of the war, nor of many natural disasters around the world yearly that don't make it onto ITN. Kicking222 (talk) 01:14, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  There was definitely consensus to post this. -- Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 23:52, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  At the time of posting, and ignoring the one pointy oppose, there were more !votes for oppose or wait than there were for support, and since then, there has also been more opposition than support. That sure doesn't scream "consensus" to me. Kicking222 (talk) 01:10, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  Consensus is more than just raw numbers of support and oppose, though. And the waits are neither support nor oppose. -- Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 03:04, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  Wait is an oppose vote. It literally means "should not be posted right now but may be suitable to be posted at another time" Noah^Talk 03:46, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  Also, seeing the posting admin assert "given the high profile coverage by all the major news outlets" as a reason to post. High volume of coverage is not a reason to post under ITN's guidelines. That coverage helped to generate a quality article in a short period of time (what we want to see at ITN), but standalone is not reason to post. Masem (t) 02:19, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Oops, i posted this in the wrong place on the page. I think we need to amend the blurb to give a numerical estimate of how many people are affected; deaths or displacements. "Mass displacements" simply isn't convincing enough, we should have a number of people affected. Does such an estimate exist? QueensanditsCrazy (talk) 00:56, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Amend the blurb to add the number 17k (number of evacuees in Ukraine), its cited in the article. Do we have a number of evacuees in Russia / russia occupied part? Or does the 17k include parts under Russian control? QueensanditsCrazy (talk) 13:12, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Pull Covered in ongoing... just another footnote in the grand scheme of the war. Mass executions and burials have taken place time and time again and we quit posting those as they were also covered by the ongoing item. This really isn't much different considering the impact of this event is speculative at best right now. Noah^Talk 01:20, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Comment I'm not seeing a clear consensus here. As of right now it looks like about half of the comments support posting with the other half split between waiting and oppose. -Ad Orientem (talk) 01:49, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support keeping it as posted. OhanaUnited^{Talk page} 02:37, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Don't Pull - Massive story, and massive long-term implications. I feel sometimes that if Ukraine were to drop a nuke on the Kremlin, someone would be shouting "Ongoing"! Nfitz (talk) 05:00, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Comment There are a lot of “Wait” votes, so it doesn’t seem like there was a consensus to post this. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 06:55, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  I've provided an explanation below - not all wait votes are the same. - Fuzheado | Talk 15:23, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Comment Most of the oppose !votes were factually incorrect. They said that it's covered by the ongoing article but that article still says nothing at all about this. They said that we don't post news about the war in Ukraine when we have repeatedly posted major incidents. And they said that there was no impact when there's clearly a giant hole in the dam now, lots of physical consequences and plenty of international outrage.

The one valid opposing argument was that the article was a stub. But that's no longer the case as the article about the dam's destruction has had hundreds of edits by over a hundred editors and now seems reasonably respectable. Well done!

Andrew🐉(talk) 07:55, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

The main article for the war can't contain all the details, which is why for ongoing we have to consider the child articles that do go into those details, which there are plenty of timelines and the like. (I have said we should be linking to a main timeline for this long of an event, similar to what we had done for COVID). So yes, those oppose !votes were valid.

Also, numerous other buildings have been destroyed with holes left in the ground. There is yet - outside of evacuations - any immediate impact of the dam, it is more the question "was this sabotage and who did it", which would be a far more compelling story in some situations. Masem (t) 12:31, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Comment I don't think this is worth the hassle of pulling at this point, but at the time it was posted there seem to have been 10 !votes for support, 10 for waiting, and 5 for oppose. That's not a consensus. We should have let the discussion run for another 24 hours to see if those advocating wait (which included me) switched to support or oppose. Posting was premature. Modest Genius ^talk 11:25, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  It seemed as if it were more of an admin supervote than a consensus. Noah^Talk 12:37, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  I've provided a longer explanation below on why I don't agree with the supervote characterization. Thanks. - Fuzheado | Talk 15:25, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Comment - As one who !voted to wait, we really shouldn't pull this now. The consensus could realistically have gone either way, yes, but the support !voters do have an edge per Andrew's reasoning (I don't find myself saying that very often). It's on the Main Page, it's the top ITN blurb, it's got a picture associated with it. Frankly, we'll look like a bunch of amateurs if we have this story up one day and then suddenly hide it the next, only to repost it again two or three days later. And I say this as someone who generally rails against Fuzheado for his admin decisions here at ITN; he got it right today. --Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 13:25, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  The admin posting is supposed to judge consensus, not decide on their own that the circumstances merit posting. nableezy - 13:51, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Well, it has been six months since the last one, to be fair... Black Kite (talk) 13:57, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  It seemed like a supervote to me, but I didn't think it was worth litigating. This context makes me think that it probably should be challenged a little more firmly when it happens. Thebiguglyalien (talk) 14:14, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

However you want to slice it, I'll say at least that it's not as egregious as misreading of consensus as the previous one. Maybe that doesn't make it a clean-cut reading of consensus, but at the same time, how can you determine consensus in a setting where it's "highly subjective" by definition? Cheers, ⛵ WaltClipper -(talk) 14:17, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for that comment. For transparency, I've posted more about the evaluation of consensus below. - Fuzheado | Talk 15:13, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Comment by poster. This is not to relitigate the issue but for transparency, I'll elaborate on the factors for evaluating the consensus that resulted in posting.

First, not all "Wait" expressions are created equal. One can say wait for something to happen; if it happens, that wait can be interpreted as support. Another wait can be for something that is extremely unlikely or never happens, which can be evaluated as an oppose. Yet another wait might be based on something not supported by policy or ITN norms, so it cannot be easily considered in the mix of !votes. That said, no fewer than 4 of the 7 wait votes leaned support ("once this starts being discussed more broadly in the news," "this could become an extremely significant event, though we will have to wait and see," "untill [sic] impact becomes clear," "precise information is still not readily available") Two of the other wait votes leaned support but wanted "tomorrow" or "24h". In the many hours that passed since those wait sentiments were expressed, a lot more information came out about the impact downstream and the evacuations. Additionally, a burst of 4 straight support votes before posting reflected the development of the news cycle and the momentum of the discussion.

Second, to address the "covered by ongoing" sentiments. As per the news cycle observation above, news outlets swiftly moved away from using explosion, blast, or attack to describe the incident. With no reliable link to either Russia or Ukraine as actors that caused the dam's destruction, the dam breach was covered as an ecological and humanitarian event in its own right. Outlets such as BBC even discussed how the road and dam conditions were deteriorating as far back as June 2 before the breach, suggesting possible explanations that did not include a military strike. Therefore, the arguments that this was "covered by ongoing" did not sync with the article or the facts in the news. It doesn't mean opposes didn't count, but it does mean rebalancing the weight of "covered by ongoing."

Within this context, the consensus favored posting as a standalone ITN item. Given the passage of 24 hours, I stand by the decision to post and am surprised by the portrayal that it was a supervote. As an addendum, the recent conversation at Wikipedia talk:In the news#Straw poll: The purpose of ITN should be noted, where there was a significant sentiment that ITN has a role to help readers find topics that are in the news or receiving attention in the mainstream press/media. While we haven't taken the feedback in that discussion to adjust any firm guidelines yet, we need to recognize that serving the readership of Wikipedia to find things of interest, and of quality, has emerged as a priority from that discussion. Thanks. - Fuzheado | Talk 14:59, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Your rationale for posting is a fine one for something other than posting. It is a rationale for a support not not-vote. But you are saying that because you think that the "covered by ongoing" opposes were trumped by sources discussing it outside of the context of the ongoing item (never mind that Ukraine has now accused Russia of blowing the dam), you are making a counter-argument, not judging consensus. Of course it was a super vote, thats why the rationale was focused on the reasons why it should be posted and not whether or not a consensus supported it being posted. When you feel that something should or should not be posted, vote, dont promote. nableezy - 15:46, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

I think the posting rationale is fine even though I procedurally opposed this because of the ongoing item. However, it’s perhaps good time to verify if we still need the ongoing item and if Russian invasion of Ukraine is the correct target. It really seems like this has turned out to be a collection of notable consequential individual events rather than a general ongoing story.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 16:28, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Indeed, I was thinking this may be an opportunity to establish some more guidelines around "ongoing" in general, as the guidance at WP:ONGOING is not deep. These types of debates have come up more often with recent issues of COVID-19 and prolonged political/military crises. Too often, it seems we are touching different parts of the elephant on how to appropriately treat ongoing (or not) stories. - Fuzheado | Talk 16:58, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

Despite opposing the posting, I am generally satisfied by this explanation. However, given your history, I would think you might want to stick to only posting clear-cut stories- indeed, I would go so far as to say that any future posting by you in which there is not obvious consensus is unacceptable, regardless of if I personally agree with it. Kicking222 (talk) 21:07, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Should the blurb mention that evacuations have been shelled(without assigning blame)? [11] 331dot (talk) 13:37, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

June 5

Portal:Current events/2023 June 5

June 5, 2023 (2023-06-05) (Monday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine 2023 Belgorod Oblast incursions The Russian Volunteer Corps claims to have captured the village of Novaya Tavolzhanka in the Belgorod region of Russia. The governor of Belgorod, Vyacheslav Gladkov, says that about 100 civilians are still trapped in the village and cannot be evacuated because of continued shelling. (Novaya Gazeta Europe) Wagner Group mercenaries publish a video of a captured Russian commander claiming that he had ordered his troops to fire on a Wagner convoy leaving Bakhmut. (The Guardian) Insurgency in Khyber Pakhtunkhwa Two soldiers and two Pakistani Taliban members are killed in a shootout in North Waziristan, Khyber Pakhtunkhwa, Pakistan. (AP) Business and economy Apple announces and demonstrates the Vision Pro mixed reality headset at its Worldwide Developers Conference. It is the company's first major new product in almost 10 years and is expected to be commercially available in early 2024. (The Washington Post) Disasters and accidents 2023 Haiti floods Fifty-one people are killed, 140 others are injured and eleven are missing after severe flooding in Haiti. (AP) One person is missing after a suspension bridge over the Ganges River in Bhagalpur district, Bihar, India, collapses for the second time in less than two months. (Reuters) Law and crime Capital punishment in South Korea The Ministry of Justice says it will submit a bill to parliament to lift the ban on carrying out death sentences after 30 years, although South Korea has not carried out an execution since 1997. (Yonhap) New South Wales Governor Margaret Beazley unconditionally pardons Kathleen Folbigg, releasing her 20 years into a 25-year sentence for killing all four of her children, after scientific and medical research suggested the deaths were caused by genetic mutations. (The Guardian) Politics and elections Mike Pence 2024 presidential campaign Former Vice President Mike Pence officially files to run for President of the United States in 2024. (BBC News) Delfina Gómez of the MORENA party defeats Alejandra del Moral Vela in the election for governor of the state of Mexico, ending 94 years of the PRI rule in the state. (ABC)

---

RD: Elspeth Campbell

Article: Elspeth Campbell (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.telegraph.co.uk/obituaries/2023/06/06/lady-campbell-of-pittenweem-elspeth-obituary-lib-dems/
Credits:

• Nominated by Onegreatjoke (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: British Baroness. Article looks fine. Onegreatjoke (talk) 16:39, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

(Ready) RD: Tina Joemat-Pettersson

Article: Tina Joemat-Pettersson (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Former minister Tina Joemat-Pettersson, 59, has died
Credits:

• Nominated by Lefcentreright (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Former South African cabinet minister. The article was in bad shape, so I rewrote it.  Lefcentreright  Discuss  21:29, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Article is B-class with good reason. Good sourcing and lots of prose. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 13:48, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support, Article has enough information and sourcing. Alex-h (talk) 15:14, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) RD/Blurb: Astrud Gilberto

Article: Astrud Gilberto (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination
Blurb:  Astrud Gilberto, who popularised bossa nova around the world, dies aged 83. (Post)
News source(s): BBC The Independent Le Monde
Credits:

• Nominated by Kirill C1 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by 205.239.40.3 (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Girl from Ipanema singer. Considering significance of song and the fact that we recently blurbed another singer, I suggest blurb. Kirill C1 (talk) 13:39, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Discography is orange-tagged, and I'd oppose a blurb. My personal rule on blurbing deaths is in order to even be considered, it should at least be a vital article. Of course, this rule isn't bulletproof, and depending on the person, I would bend it, but as far as I remember for the people we've blurbed who died Jean-Luc Godard was a vital article, Tina Turner was a vital article, Mikhail Gorbachev was a vital article, so on. That's my thoughts on it. TheBlueSkyClub (talk) 15:07, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

@TheBlueSkyClub We blurbed Shane Warne, Jean Paul-Belmondo, Jim Brown (actor and football player), Jiang Zemin, former Angola president dos Santos, former Phillipine President, actors from India. Were they all vital articles? Kirill C1 (talk) 16:25, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Yep. Brown, Warne, Belmondo, dos Santos, (I assume you were talking about Aquino III), and Zemin are all vital articles. TheBlueSkyClub (talk) 17:07, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support blurbing. if I find time this evening I'll address the issues raised by TheBlueSkyClub. Wanted to do the nom myself but... ugh... I wasn't really sure how to do it properly. --Ouro (blah blah) 15:16, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  Take my gratitude while you're at it when you do choose to do it, thank you! TheBlueSkyClub (talk) 16:15, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose blurb Article is not of a reasonable quality that readily demonstrates any impact or legacy she may have had. From what I have seen I don't think this type of section is even possible so this is not a blurb-appropriate RD. Still looks like quality issues prior to posting as RD --Masem (t) 16:55, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose blurb per Masem. The Kip (talk) 19:16, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose blurb, reluctantly. Post to RD when in good shape. If we didn't blurb João Gilberto when he passed in July 2019, it's tough to justify blurbing Astrud Gilberto. I will note that Portugeuse Wikipedia only has him on RD and not ITN. Though, interestingly, they have a policy that states, "avoid news that only interests specific countries like Brazil or Portugal." - Fuzheado | Talk 19:35, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Blurb. We post death blurbs for too many music-related persons as it is. There are many "fields" or "genres" of music, being notable for one, even if you are the premier name in said genre, is far from unique. DarkSide830 (talk) 22:42, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Blurb does not rise to the level of significance needed for a blurb, far short of a household name. 1779Days (talk) 04:40, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  But being a household name is not a criterion for blurb. Kirill C1 (talk) 05:44, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose quality Numerous tagged sourcing issues. There's also a puzzling section, Astrud Gilberto § Bibliography, which neither seems to be a list of her works nor referenced by footnotes as sources.—Bagumba (talk) 04:42, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  Sourcing now fixed. "Bibliography" moved to "Other sources". Thanks. 205.239.40.3 (talk) 10:10, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  Good work. Looks like mostly only Astrud Gilberto § Discography remains outstanding.—Bagumba (talk) 10:20, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose blurb, reluctantly. WP:NOT TINA. 205.239.40.3 (talk) 10:24, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support Discography sourcing fixed TarkusAB^talk/contrib 17:01, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  There about a handful of cites to WP:ALLMUSIC.—Bagumba (talk) 17:32, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  That's an issue? for posting to RD? TarkusAB^talk/contrib 18:30, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

  If they're not reliably sourced, the ALLMUSIC items are effectively {{Cn}}s. See also Talk:Astrud Gilberto § AllMusic—Bagumba (talk) 04:23, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support the article per se, but I also Oppose the blurb. Oltrepier (talk) 18:27, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support RD, neutral blurb Sourcing generally resolved.—Bagumba (talk) 06:31, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Posted as RD.  — Amakuru (talk) 08:14, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
• Post-posting smile. Happy to see Astrud Gilberto posted, sorry it's not as a blurb. --Ouro (blah blah) 08:44, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

RD: John Morris, Baron Morris of Aberavon

Article: John Morris, Baron Morris of Aberavon (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-politics-65484126
Credits:

• Nominated by Onegreatjoke (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Moondragon21 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: British Politician. Article needs a lot of work. Onegreatjoke (talk) 00:44, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Only 3 {cn} tags remaining. --PFHLai (talk) 10:08, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Robert Hanssen

Article: Robert Hanssen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): CBS News
Credits:

• Nominated by Sunshineisles2 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Nohomersryan (talk · give credit), Swatjester (talk · give credit) and Fakescientist8000 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: ex-FBI agent and Soviet/Russian spy. Sunshineisles2 (talk) 19:05, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

• Some unsourced statements here and there that I will get taken care of. Weak oppose for now. Support Article is good to go. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 19:47, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

  Thanks for your work on this! Sunshineisles2 (talk) 00:13, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  @Sunshineisles2 You're welcome. :) Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 00:37, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support notable person, article is good to go - Editor 5426387 (talk) 00:52, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support Looks good TarkusAB^talk/contrib 06:55, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose No, it is not ready. There is unsourced content in the article and the In the media section will have to be re-written as it is mostly composed of one-sentence paragraphs. --Vacant0 (talk) 09:56, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  Can you tag the specific sentences that you are contesting? —Bagumba (talk) 10:13, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  I've added the cn tags. Vacant0 (talk) 10:15, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  Support Issues have been addressed. Vacant0 (talk) 12:23, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Posted. Sandstein 17:03, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

RD: Jim Hines

Article: Jim Hines (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC USA Today The Guardian
Credits:

• Nominated by Black Kite (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: First man to run 100m in under 10 seconds. Died 3rd June, news released today. Article needs a lot of work. Black Kite (talk) 18:42, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

• Weak support He's definitely notable enough, but I agree that the article still needs more sources and cleaning up to be ready. Oltrepier (talk) 07:14, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose for now Once more references get added, the article will be ready for RD. --Vacant0 (talk) 09:52, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Article is in unfortunately poor condition for ITNRD. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 17:04, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

June 4

Portal:Current events/2023 June 4

June 4, 2023 (2023-06-04) (Sunday) Armed conflicts and attacks 2023 Sudan conflict The Sudanese Armed Forces bombs the International University of Africa in Khartoum, killing ten Congolese nationals. DRC Foreign Minister Christophe Lutundula says his country has demanded an explanation from the Sudanese government. (BBC News) Seventy-seven primary school girls are hospitalised after a poison attack on two schools in Sancharak, Sar-e Pol, Afghanistan. (CNA) Business and economy 2021–2023 global energy crisis Saudi Arabia's energy ministry announces a cut in oil production from around ten million barrels per day this month to nine million barrels per day from July. Oil prices on Brent and West Texas Intermediate futures initially rise by more than two per cent, but later fall slightly. (CNBC) Disasters and accidents 2023 Virginia plane crash A Cessna Citation plane crashes over mountainous terrain after being intercepted by an F-16 jet over Washington, D.C., killing the four people on board. The plane was flying from Elizabethton Municipal Airport, Tennessee, United States, to Long Island MacArthur Airport, New York. (AP) Fourteen people are killed and five others are missing after a landslide in a mountainous area near Leshan, Sichuan, China. (Reuters) One person is killed and 14 others are injured when a bus travelling from Lecce in Puglia to Rome crashes on a motorway in Vallesaccarda, Campania, Italy. (Ansa) One person is killed and ten others are injured in a fire at a refugee centre in Apolda, Thuringia, Germany. (AP) Politics and elections 2023 Guinea-Bissau legislative election The citizens of Guinea-Bissau go to the polls to elect 102 members of the National People's Assembly. (Reuters) 2023 Polish protests Anti-government protests erupt across Poland, with an estimated 500,000 demonstrators gathering in the capital of Warsaw, according to Mayor Rafał Trzaskowski. (AP)

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RD: George Winston

Article: George Winston (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The New York Times
Credits:

• Nominated by Bagumba (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Hzh (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American pianist —Bagumba (talk) 05:10, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Ongoing: 2023 Polish protests

Article: 2023 Polish protests (talk · history · tag)
Ongoing item nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC News; Associated Press; Il Post; The Guardian
Credits:

• Nominated by Oltrepier (talk · give credit)
• Created by Fakescientist8000 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Fakescientist8000 (talk · give credit), CynicNerd (talk · give credit) and Oltrepier (talk · give credit)

Article updated

Nominator's comments: These protests are significant not only for their political background, but also because they've come just months before the latest national election cycle, in a polarized social climate that has been deeply affected by the consequences of the constitutional crisis. Depending on the overall length of the protests, I would not mind converting this nomination into a "standard" ITN blurb, if needed. Oltrepier (talk) 08:49, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Comment: My bad, I forgot to mention: the article is still being expanded and re-worked extensively, but anyway, it shouldn't be too hard to bring it in good shape. Oltrepier (talk) 08:52, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose and Wait Let's wait, the protests only began two days ago. If this develops into something more, it could be posted to ITN. We also have the 2023 Serbian protests, which began almost a month ago, shortly after the two mass shootings, yet it has not been nominated to ITN even though it has also garnered international attention due to its size. --Vacant0 (talk) 09:50, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

RD: Sulochana Latkar

Article: Sulochana Latkar (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): The Times of India
Credits:

• Nominated by Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Indian Actress Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 19:46, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose The Career sections appears to be an entire reshuffle of the filmography, just converted into prose. Oh, and it's all unsourced. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 23:54, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

June 3

Portal:Current events/2023 June 3

June 3, 2023 (2023-06-03) (Saturday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine Attacks on civilians in the Russian invasion of Ukraine Russian forces strike a residential area in Dnipro Raion with Iskander cruise missiles, killing a two-year-old girl and injuring 22 other civilians, including five children. (Reuters) Egypt–Israel relations 2023 Egypt–Israel border shooting incident Three Israeli soldiers and an Egyptian policeman are killed in an exchange of fire near the Egyptian-Israeli border. It is the first fatal incident between the two countries in more than a decade. (The Washington Post) Aftermath of the Chiapas conflict Seven people are killed during a mass shooting against villagers in Polhó, a Zapatista community in Chenalhó, Mexico. (La Prensa Latina) Business and economy 2023 United States debt-ceiling crisis President Joe Biden signs the Fiscal Responsibility Act of 2023 to prevent the United States from breaching its debt ceiling. (NBC News) Disasters and accidents 2023 Nova Scotia wildfires A wildfire in Shelburne County, Nova Scotia, Canada, continues to burn out of control, becoming the largest wildfire in the province's history. (CBC News) Four children are found dead on a beach in Portneuf-sur-Mer, Quebec, Canada, after eleven people on a fishing trip on the St. Lawrence River were caught in a tidal bore and went missing. Six of the eleven people have been rescued, while one man is still missing. (CNN) Two people are killed when a small plane crashes at Tupelo Regional Airport in Tupelo, Mississippi, USA. (AP) One person is killed, another injured and 14 rescued after an overcrowded boat capsizes off the coast of Haiti. (AP) Law and crime 2023 Epsom Derby Surrey Police make 19 arrests on suspicion of "conspiracy to cause public nuisance" ahead of the Epsom Derby. (BBC Sport) Seven people are killed and two others injured in a mass shooting at a hostel in the township of Umlazi, KwaZulu-Natal, South Africa. (News 24) Politics and elections Third inauguration of Recep Tayyip Erdoğan The third inauguration of Recep Tayyip Erdoğan as President of Turkey takes place at the Presidential Complex in Ankara. (TIME) Sports 2022–23 FA Cup In association football, Manchester City beat rivals Manchester United 2–1 in the FA Cup final at Wembley Stadium in London to win their seventh FA Cup title. İlkay Gündoğan breaks the record for the fastest goal in an FA Cup final, scoring after just 12 seconds. (BBC Sport) 2022–23 UEFA Women's Champions League FC Barcelona Femení lifted the UEFA Women's Champions League trophy for the second time after defeating VfL Wolfsburg 3–2 in the final at the Philips Stadion in Eindhoven, Netherlands. Fridolina Rolfö scored the winner after Barcelona had trailed 2–0 at the break. (Al Jazeera)

---

RD: Aamir Raza Husain

Article: Aamir Raza Husain (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.canindia.com/aamir-raza-husain-creator-of-stage-spectacles-passes-away-aged-66/
Credits:

• Nominated by Onegreatjoke (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Indian Actor. Article is almost there but there's a bad filmography, an IMDB citation, a when? tag, and some permanent dead links keeping it down. Onegreatjoke (talk) 00:36, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) Haiti floods

Article: 2023 Haiti floods (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ Flooding across Haiti leaves at least 51 people dead and 11 others missing. (Post)
News source(s): ReliefWeb
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by Cyclonebiskit (talk · give credit)
• Created by Moondragon21 (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: Significant loss of life across a nation struggling to recover from a seemingly endless string of natural and man-made disasters. Information is a little scarce, typical for Haiti, but should be more available as the story gains traction. ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 20:43, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support for the reasons stated. Moondragon21 (talk) 21:49, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

Support - article can do with some expansion, but it looks good enough for posting. - Knightoftheswords281 (Talk · Contribs) 17:58, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

Support The article is important enough, it has enough references & it seems like it’s just big enough to meet the standards for posting. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 07:08, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support, Significant loss. important news Alex-h (talk) 15:06, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Weak support Article feels a little thin but probably just enough for ITN. The Kip (talk) 18:48, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Posted Stephen 03:30, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

(Closed) Nova Scotia wildfires

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

Article: 2023 Nova Scotia wildfires (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ In Canada, a series of wildfires batter the province of Nova Scotia. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ In Canada, a series of wildfires batter the Provinces and territories of Canada of Nova Scotia in the largest in the province's history.
Alternative blurb II: ​ In Canada, wildfires from the province of Nova Scotia sends smoke as far down as the U.S. state of Virginia.
News source(s): BBC - [12] - USA Today
Credits:

• Nominated by Knightoftheswords281 (talk · give credit)
• Created by B3251 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Nsediter (talk · give credit), HighlandFacts (talk · give credit) and PalauanLibertarian (talk · give credit)

Nominator's comments: Wildfires have rocked Nova Scotia in the past few days. Not exactly sure what is the minimum threshold is for consensus to emerge here, but they are pretty historic, being the largest in Nova Scotian history, forcing dozens of thousands to evacuate, and sending smoke as far down as Virginia in the US. - Knightoftheswords281 (Talk · Contribs) 03:13, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose for a couple of reasons. The first is that the situation is improving, thus making this less of a developing news story.[13][14] But even if the status quo remained as it was before, widespread wildfires have unfortunately become an annual occurrence in North America. People being required to evacuate their homes is basically routine, and approving a blurb about a wildfire for the main page requires exceptional circumstances (e.g. numerous deaths, large-scale destruction). Think along the lines of the Fort McMurray fire from 2016, or the fires in Australia from just before COVID. Kurtis ^(talk) 03:44, 4 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose Wildfires, even in Canada, are common this time of year, and unless we have significant damage, this is not rising to significance for ITN. (I mean, we didn't post the earlier BC wildfires that were sending smoke into WA and OR, for example). --Masem (t) 04:38, 4 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose The threshold is certainly higher than "no reported human casualties". -- Kicking222 (talk) 11:11, 4 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose. Per above. Moreover, the article is very short and no fatalities are reported from the fire yet. 🛧Layah50♪🛪 ( 話す? 一緒に飛ぼう！) 14:03, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

June 2

Portal:Current events/2023 June 2

June 2, 2023 (2023-06-02) (Friday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine Southern Ukraine campaign Russian occupation official Vladimir Rogov says Ukrainian forces have shelled the port of Berdiansk in Zaporizhzhia Oblast, injuring nine people. (Reuters) Allied Democratic Forces insurgency, Kivu conflict Nine people are killed when Allied Democratic Forces insurgents attack a group of people on the Kyondo-Kyavinyonge road in North Kivu, Democratic Republic of the Congo. (AP) Arts and culture Removal of Confederate monuments and memorials The U.S. Army base at Fort Bragg, North Carolina, named after Confederate General Braxton Bragg, is renamed Fort Liberty. (Reuters) Disasters and accidents 2023 Odisha train collision At least 288 people are killed and more than 900 injured in a train collision in Balasore district, Odisha, India. (India Today) (Al Jazeera) 2023 Atlantic hurricane season Tropical Storm Arlene forms as the first named storm of the 2023 Atlantic hurricane season. (The Washington Post) One person is killed and nine others injured by a fire in a high-rise building in Rome, Italy. (BBC News) 2023 Central Canada wildfires The government of Sept-Îles, Quebec, Canada, declares a state of emergency and orders the evacuation of more than 10,000 residents following a series of wildfires in the eastern part of the country. (CNA) Health and environment Japan's fertility rate is expected to have reached a record low of 1.2565 in 2022. (Reuters) International relations Foreign nationals detained in Iran Iran releases one Danish and two dual Austrian-Iranian citizens. (BBC News) Law and crime Assassination of Jovenel Moïse A Florida court in the United States sentences a Haitian-Chilean national to life in prison for the July 2021 assassination of Haitian President Jovenel Moïse. (The Guardian)

---

(Posted) RD: Yukiko Takayama

Article: Yukiko Takayama (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.yomiuri.co.jp/culture/cinema/20230602-OYT1T50187/
Credits:

• Nominated by Onegreatjoke (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Japanese Screenwriter. Article looks alright (with a cited filmography!) Onegreatjoke (talk) 00:27, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Looks fine for RD. --Vacant0 (talk) 09:41, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Posted Stephen 03:26, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

RD: Michail Kostarakos

Article: Michail Kostarakos (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://greekreporter.com/2023/06/02/former-chief-greek-armed-forces-michail-kostarakos-dies/
Credits:

• Nominated by Onegreatjoke (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Greek Soldier. Article looks there but then there's the problem of most of the article being sourced to a permanent dead link and there being zero mention of his death. Onegreatjoke (talk) 00:23, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose for now Per nominator. --Vacant0 (talk) 09:40, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

RD: Muhammad Afsarul Ameen

Article: Muhammad Afsarul Ameen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): https://www.tbsnews.net/bangladesh/chattogram-10-mp-afsarul-ameen-dies-642778
Credits:

• Nominated by Onegreatjoke (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Bangladeshi politician. Article feels almost there. Onegreatjoke (talk) 00:18, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose The career section is mostly comprised of him being elected and re-elected. If there is some information about his actual career that he did as minister and in the parliament, it should be added. For now, it is a stub. --Vacant0 (talk) 09:37, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Natasha Al-Maani

Article: Natasha Al-Maani (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Jordan News
Credits:

• Nominated by Thebiguglyalien (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Jordanian artist Thebiguglyalien (talk) 02:01, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Looks alright. User talk:Leeeunsuk 16:19, 5 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support Short but prose and sourcing appears sufficient. Black Kite (talk) 07:22, 5 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support Based on the news source, it seems to be significant news about someone of high recognition and reputation. I believe it is worthy of being posted. Meloncookie (talk) 07:31, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

Suppott It's Looks alright,There are ample sources under existing articles,As a Pakistani woman writer I think she has a unique understanding of feminism, but I think I can describe her work in more detail.악준동 (talk) 07:44, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

• Suppott Article has enough sources and prose to satisfy ITNRD standards. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 14:55, 5 June 2023 (UTC)
• Suppott, Short article but has enough citation. Alex-h (talk) 16:58, 5 June 2023 (UTC)
• Posted Stephen 23:37, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Kaija Saariaho

Article: Kaija Saariaho (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): BBC New York Times
Credits:

• Nominated by BangJan1999 (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: Finnish composer. BangJan1999 22:31, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Article looks ready. Lots of prose and very well sourced. TwistedAxe [contact] 10:30, 3 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support Looks alright. Ollieisanerd (talk • contribs) 17:28, 3 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support - Sourced and ready.BabbaQ (talk) 17:29, 3 June 2023 (UTC)
• Posted—Bagumba (talk) 18:23, 3 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support—This report is vivid and detailed, vividly showing the emotional state and behavior of the characters, so that readers can truly feel the charm and inner world of the characters, as well as their role and influence in the event. The news can enable readers to have a deeper understanding and pay attention to the people reported.Muqing112233 (talk) 07:35, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) 2023 Balasore train collision

Article: 2023 Odisha train collision (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ More than 200 people are killed in a collision between two passenger trains and a goods train in Balasore, Odisha, India. (Post)
Alternative blurb: ​ More than 200 people are killed and more than 900 injured in a collision between two passsenger trains and a goods train in Balasore, Odisha, India.
News source(s): Guardian Hindustan Times
Credits:

• Nominated by Black Kite (talk · give credit)

Article updated

Nominator's comments: Serious train collision in India. Information still coming in, hence article is still a stub. Black Kite (talk) 18:29, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support on significance, oppose on quality information on this story is still very fresh, and the death toll is very likely to rise significantly. Because information is still fresh, the article cannot possibly be ready for the front page, but I expect that the article will be ready for the front page soon. NorthernFalcon (talk) 18:58, 2 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support once article quality improves presuming more information comes out which I'm certain it will. Kcmastrpc (talk) 19:06, 2 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support in principle Article quality needs to be improved, and once it's expanded enough consider this a support. No doubt about notability, deaths have already risen to ~150. TwistedAxe [contact] 19:50, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

Support - WP:ITNMINIMUIMDEATHS is not a thing, but 150 70 deaths clearly establish notability per WP:NEVENTS. Article quality ought to be improved however. - Knightoftheswords281 (Talk · Contribs) 20:33, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

I support it, but it’s at least 70 killed, not 150. The Kip (talk) 20:43, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

My fault. - Knightoftheswords281 (Talk · Contribs) 21:11, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

The idea that WP:NEVENTS grants notability on the basis of "death count" is a common falsehood that people need to stop perpetuating. Thebiguglyalien (talk) 23:07, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

Death count is a good indicator of notability, though, especially when it's greater than 50 people. -- Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 00:04, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support upon expansion Article isn’t great but seems notable enough for the front page. The Kip (talk) 20:44, 2 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support on significance due to number of casualties. {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 21:20, 2 June 2023 (UTC)
• Sources (mainly Reuters and BBC) are now saying over 200 have died, so I would support even if the quality is lacking. RandomInfinity17 (talk - contributions) 22:40, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

  Agreed. The train that was involved regularly cruises at over 115kph, and all indications are pointing towards a full-speed collision given the casualties. What a sad tragedy. Kcmastrpc (talk) 22:44, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

• Strong Support even if quality is lacking, this is huge news given the number of deaths (> 200). Rest in peace to all the victims. :( --Rockstone^{Send me a message!} 22:43, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

Support once the article's quality improves This is obviously significant enough to post, but the article's quality isn't good enough yet. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 22:57, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

• Posted Article is beyond stub stage and will expand. Subject is a massive transportation related disaster and a no brainer for ITN. -Ad Orientem (talk) 23:01, 2 June 2023 (UTC)
• Post-posting support. This is a good example of striking a balance between swiftly posting an article around a newsworthy event in the public interest while also being in an acceptable and useful state. Good work around a tragic event. - Fuzheado | Talk 23:18, 2 June 2023 (UTC)
• Post-posting support. I support the blurb. That said, I don't understand why it is illustrated by a picture of Modi visiting the site. I have absolutely no animosity against Modi, but it isn't appropriate to make such a tragic event something about him. The picture should be one of the crash. This personality cult is indecent in the present context — Preceding unsigned comment added by Varoon2542 (talk • contribs) 21:28, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

• Amend picture Currently we are showing a picture of Modi at the site. This is not very informative as the wreckage is in the background while Modi and his party are in the foreground. As this is a posed political PR picture, it is contrary to WP:PROMO. And note that the Indian government is currently threatening to block access to Wikipedia.

Instead of the Modi picture, I suggest that the article's diagram (right) be shown as this is more informative – showing the configuration of this complex crash.

Andrew🐉(talk) 07:06, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

Support change to diagram as illustrator. cmɢʟee⎆τaʟκ 08:20, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

The diagram is simplified, not representing the lengths of the trains for example, and there is nothing to verify the content. It will not look good in a thumbnail. Stephen 12:21, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

Though simplified as insufficient data has been released to make an accurate reconstruction, it gives a far better idea of the crash than prose does. Professional news media illustrations have around the same amount of detail:

• https://timesofindia.com/india/how-interlocking-system-ensures-safety-in-rail-operations/amp_articleshow/100752280.cms
• https://indianexpress.com/article/explained/how-did-the-odisha-train-crash-happen-8644109/lite/
• ttps://www.opindia.com/2023/06/electronic-interlocking-point-machines-and-their-links-to-the-odisha-train-crash/amp/

Cheers, cmɢʟee⎆τaʟκ 14:12, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

opindia is a blacklisted source, fwiw. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 15:00, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support.I think that such a large-scale catastrophic event needs to be delivered to the reader in a timely manner, and the number of deaths exceeds 200, which is a worldwide tragedy. Even though the quality of the article still leaves room for improvement, I still choose to support the publication. However, please pay attention to the subsequent data update, I think that among the more than 900 injured, there will still be cases of death after serious injuries. Zhou Yuji1028 (talk) 07:37, 5 June 2023 (UTC)
• I agree the picture needs changing; better to have no image at all than to promote one particular political party at an especially tragic event. Optics, people, optics. SN54129 15:18, 5 June 2023 (UTC)
• Image changed to File:Odisha crash.svg per the above discussion. Sandstein 15:58, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

June 1

Portal:Current events/2023 June 1

June 1, 2023 (2023-06-01) (Thursday) Armed conflicts and attacks Russian invasion of Ukraine 2022–2023 Western Russia attacks Russia says they have prevented three attacks by the Russian Volunteer Corps in Belgorod Oblast. (The New Voice of Ukraine via Yahoo! News) (Reuters) Belgorod Governor Vyacheslav Gladkov says that Ukrainian forces have shelled Shebekino with BM-21 Grad rockets, damaging a dormitory and an administrative building in the town. Hundreds of people are evacuated. (Reuters) Attacks on civilians in the Russian invasion of Ukraine Russia launches cruise missiles and ballistic missiles at Kyiv, killing three civilians and injuring 12 others. (AFP via Arab News) 2023 Sudan conflict Twenty-seven people are killed and at least 106 others are injured when rockets are fired at a market in Khartoum, Sudan. (The Guardian) (BBC News) Disasters and accidents Three people in Lakhsh District, eastern Tajikistan are killed by a landslide. (RFE/RL) Law and crime 2018–2023 Haitian crisis At least 160 suspected gang members were killed in Haiti between April 24 and May 24 by armed citizens after an increase in violence across the country. (Al Jazeera) Bill Cosby sexual assault cases A new lawsuit is filed against American actor Bill Cosby by Playboy model Victoria Valentino, accusing him of drugging and raping her in 1969. (NBC News) Nine people are killed during protests in Dakar and Ziguinchor, Senegal, between the police and supporters of convicted opposition leader Ousmane Sonko. (France 24) Four people are injured by a knife attack at a school in Eskilstuna, Södermanland, Sweden. (Reuters) Mexican drug war Authorities find 45 bags containing human remains in Jalisco, Mexico, after seven people were reported missing in the state last week. (CBS News) A Swiss appeals court finds former Liberian rebel commander Alieu Kosiah guilty of crimes against humanity committed during the First Liberian Civil War, sentencing him to 20 years in prison at first instance. (Sinar Daily) Salvadoran President Nayib Bukele announces that the government will construct a prison to hold white-collar criminals. He also announces that the country's security forces had raided the properties of former president Alfredo Cristiani. (Reuters) Politics and elections 2024 Salvadoran general election Nayib Bukele officially proposes two bills to the Legislative Assembly to reduce the number of municipalities from 262 to 44 and the number of seats in the Legislative Assembly from 84 to 60. (La Prensa Gráfica) Capital punishment in Zimbabwe The parliament of Zimbabwe votes in favour of a new clause of the penal code which will introduce the death penalty for "unpatriotic acts" such as supporting sanctions on the country or supporting calls to overthrow the government. (Africa Feeds) Wedding of Hussein, Crown Prince of Jordan, and Rajwa Al Saif Crown Prince of Jordan Hussein bin Abdullah marries Saudi architect and distant relative of the Saud family Rajwa Al Saif in the Jordanian capital of Amman. (CNN) 2023 United States debt-ceiling crisis The United States Senate passes the Fiscal Responsibility Act of 2023, sending the measure to President Joe Biden to sign in order to avoid a debt ceiling default. (CBS News)

---

(Attention needed) 2023 Senegalese protests

Article: 2023 Senegalese protests (talk · history · tag)
Blurb: ​ At least 16 people are killed during the 2023 Senegalese protests. (Post)
News source(s): France 24, CNN
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by Blaylockjam10 (talk · give credit)
• Created by Ainty Painty (talk · give credit)

Article updated

 Blaylockjam10 (talk) 10:53, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Comment Could this constitute a nomination for the "Ongoing events" section, as well? Oltrepier (talk) 11:44, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

  It seems like it might fit that category. Blaylockjam10 (talk) 20:54, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Would prefer additional information about the protests, but meets minimum depth standards and the article explains why people are protesting. Oppose ongoing at present. Spencer^T•C 04:30, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support as for Spencer's comment above. Oltrepier (talk) 09:56, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support Also seconding Spencer's comment. The Kip (talk) 03:40, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Cynthia Weil

Article: Cynthia Weil (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Rolling Stone, BBC, The Guardian, NYT
Credits:

• Nominated by 86.187.174.181 (talk · give credit)
• Updated by Actualcpscm (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: American songwriter who wrote many songs together with her husband Barry Mann, e.g. "You've Lost That Lovin' Feelin'" 86.187.174.181 (talk) 19:44, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support One CN tag, but other than that the article looks okay. TwistedAxe [contact] 12:48, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

   Done Source now provided. No tags. 86.187.237.236 (talk) 21:53, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Multiple time Hall of Famer is generally, along with article, supportable for me. TheCorriynial (talk) 02:11, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

This looks Ready. What is stopping it? 86.187.175.143 (talk) 16:23, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Cynthia Weil § Songs written by Barry Mann and Cynthia Weil is largely unsourced.—Bagumba (talk) 18:09, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

  Does it matter that most of the songs have their own articles? What are the rules about that? Is the main article List of songs written by Barry Mann and Cynthia Weil adequately sourced, or does it also need work? 86.187.173.71 (talk) 18:20, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

  The policy is WP:CIRCULAR, Wikipedia does not use itself as a source. Each page stands on its own for verifiability. If sources on another page make sense, feel free to reuse them.—Bagumba (talk) 10:47, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

  Sources now copied across. 86.187.235.80 (talk) 12:16, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

  Struck oppose.—Bagumba (talk) 16:00, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

· Support The integrity of the article is quite high. I approve of publication.Sandykkzk (talk) 07:42, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Marking as ready per all above. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 23:19, 5 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support I don't see any issues with the article, it is ready to be posted. --Vacant0 (talk) 09:34, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
• Posted—Bagumba (talk) 10:17, 6 June 2023 (UTC)

(Posted) RD: Margit Carstensen

Article: Margit Carstensen (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Süddeutsche Zeitung
Credits:

• Updated and nominated by Grimes2 (talk · give credit)

Article updated
Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

Nominator's comments: German actress, Tatort and Fassbinder films. Grimes2 (talk) 13:50, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

Well-referenced, seems ready to post --- Crecy1346 (talk) 14:06, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose Some unsourced statements in the Theater career and Film and television sections, and the lead should be longer than one sentence. Support Article's issues have been cleaned up, and this is good to go for ITNRD. Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 14:42, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

   Done Grimes2 (talk) 15:36, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

  Grimes2, thank you! Cheers, atque supra! Fakescientist8000 18:29, 2 June 2023 (UTC)

• Thank you, Grimes2, for finding refs! I was afraid I would have to do the work, and have no time ;) - Two paras end with no citation, but I bet that can be fixed easily. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 05:17, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

   Done Grimes2 (talk) 05:30, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

  thank you, support --Gerda Arendt (talk) 05:38, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

• Support Looks good. TwistedAxe [contact] 12:47, 3 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support - sourced and ready.BabbaQ (talk) 17:30, 3 June 2023 (UTC)
• Posted—Bagumba (talk) 18:26, 3 June 2023 (UTC)

RD: Vellayani Arjunan

Article: Vellayani Arjunan (talk · history · tag)
Recent deaths nomination (Post)
News source(s): Manorama News
Credits:

• Nominated by Fahads1982 (talk · give credit)

Recent deaths of any person, animal or organism with a Wikipedia article are always presumed to be important enough to post (see this RFC and further discussion). Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article meets WP:ITNRD.

 Fahads1982 (talk) 09:39, 1 June 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose for now - Article is too short, in my opinion. ⇒ Lucie Person (talk|contribs) 16:07, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
• Support Article looks ok for ITNRD, it's not a blurb we're nominating. The article could obviously use some more work but it's okay in its current state. TwistedAxe [contact] 20:24, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose for now – Article needs to be given a decent structure. Much of the prose is in the lead; the lead is supposed to be the summary of the article's content. Schwede66 02:44, 2 June 2023 (UTC)